Disappearing ORBX folder? Read on ...

[John Venema]

We have encountered a number of posts on these forums from customers advising us that their entire ORBX folder has disappeared. The blame is being pointed at the 151108 Orbxlibs release.

 

Firstly, let me assure you that there is absolutely nothing wrong with that Orbxlibs installer and there's no need to be concerned about your ORBX folder disappearing if you have purchased legitimate licenses for all your Orbx products from day one.

 

Please allow me to remind everyone that you don't own any Orbx software, products or libraries. What we sell is a *license* fee that gives you permission to use our intellectual property on a single PC for personal use. Of course, we also sell a commercial variant of that license. We have clear links to the End User License Agreement (EULA) on our website here: https://fullterrain.com/eula

 

Furthermore, since our first product release back in March 2008 we have asked every single customer to click on a button in the installer applications to agree to those EULA terms, and again we offer a printed copy in the User Guide.

 

The license is not transferrable. You can't buy someone else's copy on eBay or Amazon etc. You can't install a 'friend's' copy, or receive it as a 'gift' from someone. You can only buy them from flightsimstore.com (they sell vouchers if you do want to gift Orbx products, by the way).

 

Allow me to give an analogy: If you are of driving age, the government in your country asks for a paid fee to sit either a theory and/or practical test and then awards you the privilege to drive a vehicle. You don't own the privilege, it's the government's right to take it away, as it often does if you breach the terms of your license. I know; I lost my driving license twice in my youth when I was a bit reckless. It sure taught me a good lesson.

 

So then, we make it clear that you need a valid paid license to use our software.

 

However, if in the past at any time you have perhaps "tried before you buy" and availed yourself to a copy of Orbx software from any source other than flightsimstore.com or a previously authorised DVD reseller, whatever mechanism that was used to install that unauthorised copy of Orbx software was logged onto your Windows system somewhere.

 

Every now and again we release products (they can be Orbxlibs, regions, airports - these are random) where the installer checks for any evidence of past unauthorised Orbx products having been installed on your PC. In that instance if we detect a breach of the EULA, we reserve our right to remove all our intellectual property from the ORBX folder. You have essentially forfeited your privilege to use our software, so we're enforcing our rights as the owner and publisher of it. Please note that we do not touch anything outside the ORBX folder, nor interfere with your Windows or PC installation or other vendors' products.

 

How do you fix this situation?

 

The solution is to think back to that "try before you buy" (to clarify: pirated, torrented, illegal) Orbx product that was installed and then go and purchase an authorised license from flightsimstore.com for that and any other unauthorised products that may have been installed in the past.

 

Here's the hard part: You will need to re-install Windows from scratch to prevent a random Orbx installer from affecting the ORBX folder yet again.

 

Whilst this may cause you inconvenience, it pales into insignificance compared to the millions of dollars worth of Orbx products that have been stolen in the past eight years. I need to remind people that Orbx provides a means of income for many people, some of who develop on a full-time basis and who can spend up to 12-18 months working on a single project at a time. We have a zero tolerance policy towards customers who think they can download our products from unauthorised sources. Those people who have been affected recently will be contacted and given a ban from the Orbx support forums for a few months to think about their actions and allow them time to purchase legitimate copies.

 

So it matters not if you've purchased every single Orbx product including a few "try before I buy" copies in the past; you need to ensure 100% of your product installers come from FSS and if you have experienced an ORBX folder loss you will need to re-install Windows.

 

I will make the unusual step of leaving this open to discussion but the moment the topic becomes antisocial it will be locked. I don't want to see any inflammatory posts or cries of "how dare you call me a pirate" etc etc. I can promise you that the tech we used to detect unauthorised activity has been thoroughly tested, and this is borne out by the fact is has affected only 9-10 people out of some 3,000 installs of Orbxlibs in the past week.

 

It actually beggars belief that these people are posting on the Orbx forums in these circumstances.

 

To the majority (and I mean, 99,9% of the 57,875 registered forum users) who always support Orbx by purchasing licenses from flightsimstore.com - I say "thank you".

[Bruce Hamilton]

Interesting... sort of along the lines of cable companies sending bullets to fry unauthorized cable boxes.  Quite a few people got busted on this one.

[Jack the Swede in Spain]

A big THANK YOU to JV for this posting! Finally we might get rid of postings asking for support for products they have not bought. Just wish you had done this much earlier. You, ORBX and the rest of the staff have risen 1,000 percent in my esteem. 

 

Have ALL your products (legally bought) and will continue to buy them when you release new products. 

 

 

Jack

the Swede in Spain

[John Venema]

Oh trust me, we have done this multiple times earlier. And it's not the last time we'll do it either. It's the just first time we have had significant "noise" about it on our forums.

[Uberscrew]

Brilliantly put John and couldn't agree more.  It's the 0.01% that threaten to jeopardise the existence of the developers that create the magic associated with the hobby we love and all the inconvenience in the world is not justice enough - we all have a responsibility to challenge anyone we know engaged in this illegal activity.

[Adam Banks]

John - my input into that particular topic was about incorrect filepaths being created between the 2 P3D versions. I haven't lost any sceneries etc. Ed thinks there may in fact be a problem. Would it be OK to start a new thread on that topic [only]? Or ask Ed (or whoever) to PM me - I'm only trying to help.

 

Adam.

[Penzoil3]

ROFLMAO!  Great! Love it! 

LOL

 Sue

[John Venema]

2 minutes ago, Adam_NZ said:

John - my input into that particular topic was about incorrect filepaths being created between the 2 P3D versions. I haven't lost any sceneries etc. Ed thinks there may in fact be a problem. Would it be OK to start a new thread on that topic [only]? Or ask Ed (or whoever) to PM me - I'm only trying to help.

 

Adam.

 

No worries Adam, be sure to give the topic a relevant title and work with Ed towards the solution. 

[Adam Banks]

OK - great (will do) - and thanks!

 

Adam.

[pmb]

This is completely correct. Finally it's us - the paying customers - paying the bills for the "other ones".

 

Kind regards, Michael

[HiFlyer]

Oh, I was expecting something like this. The only problem is that this is a brand new version of windows 10 about a month old. I Just did a clean install of windows as an experiment, and you can see my posts regarding that on other forums as I detailed my results and opinions of the OS.

 

I don't use Orbx stuff. I stopped several years ago because I realized I was buying area after area and never visiting them, and honestly FSX was just getting too old. (It hurts my eyes!) Orbx is nice, but I found the switching zones and other things annoying, and eventually I uninstalled FSX as well, and have not had that running for a long time, either.

 

Finally after years, (I stopped with Orbx about the time Ms-flight came out) I try it again with FSX-SE and immediately get errors. First the installer said fsx could not be found on my system ( I only had fsx-se) and your installers flat refused to work. After some research, I found some registry tools, and used each of them to try to create a path to FSX-SE, and that didn't work either. I uninstalled and reinstalled FSX-se and your installer still could not locate it, so I rebooted it on the theory that my registry changes might need to "settle"

 

After reboot, your installer located FSX-se and I installed my purchased products then flew for a bit, but as usual, hated all the control panels and wanted them gone. The whole point of the experiment was to see if you finally had a combined control panel that would do away with the search for updates and all the other things that made me give up in the first place.

 

Now this. I have read on several other forums about your ability to delete folders under suspicion to piracy but did I mention this is a clean install of windows 10?

 

Overnight I have carefully installed only orbx australia, and a few australian cities which are working correctly now, but after this, I'm more than a bit done all over again with the whole process. In fact I'm probably going to just give up on Orbx for another few years, until you are on Steam and installation is not a chore.

 

 

[uncle_adolph]

It did amuse me on one occasion, I think it was the first Global patch, when something similar was done leading to a number of complaints.....including from one user who helpfully added a screen shot of his desktop complete with shortcut to uTorrent! 

 

Anyhow, nice one.

 

 

[Kilstorm]

Thank you for clearing this up from a leaser of prolly 90% of your products.  I was starting to worry that I got lucky on my last OrbxLib install as I didnt have any issue but was concerned that the next time it would happen to me. Now I can rest in peace knowing what is happening and not have to be worried about it happening to me...ever.

 

[dhasdell]

" The solution is to think back to that "try before you buy" Orbx product that was installed and then go and purchase an authorised license from flightsimstore.com for that and any other unauthorised products that may have been installed in the past "

 

This is all very well, but how would a legitimate user who has decided not to purchase after a trial get rid of the item?. Presumably simply deleting the relevant folder wouldn't be enough?

[John Venema]

2 minutes ago, dhasdell said:

This is all very well, but how would a legitimate user who has decided not to purchase after a trial get rid of the item?. Presumably simply deleting the relevant folder wouldn't be enough?

 

I assume you are referring to our free Demos on the FTX website? The PNW demo has its own uninstaller which cleanly removes itself. If our other demos don't convince you then we can assist with advice on manually uninstalling.

[Ben McClintock]

Just now, dhasdell said:

" The solution is to think back to that "try before you buy" Orbx product that was installed and then go and purchase an authorised license from flightsimstore.com for that and any other unauthorised products that may have been installed in the past "

 

This is all very well, but how would a legitimate user who has decided not to purchase after a trial get rid of the item?. Presumably simply deleting the relevant folder wouldn't be enough?

When JV says "try before you buy", he is referring to people that download a pirated copy of a product with the intention of "testing" it before they purchase (regardless of whether they eventually do purchase it or not).

 

We do have our official demos of FTX Global and Pacific Northwest (with KHQM) which people can use to gauge the quality of our products without resorting to piracy. So there's nothing to worry about if you've used any of our demos/freeware.

[dhasdell]

OK, thank you.

 

[John Venema]

19 minutes ago, HiFlyer said:

Oh, I was expecting something like this. .........

 

Overnight I have carefully installed only orbx australia, and a few australian cities which are working correctly now, but after this, I'm more than a bit done all over again with the whole process. In fact I'm probably going to just give up on Orbx for another few years, until you are on Steam and installation is not a chore.

 

 

 

You will need to send your product keys and purchase info for FTX Australia to ed@orbxsystems.com and ask him to validate them and see why this happened to you.

 

If using airport and region specific control panels is too much of a hassle for you then I agree Orbx is perhaps not for you.

[Mallard]

1 hour ago, John Venema said:

 

However, if in the past at any time you have perhaps "tried before you buy" and availed yourself to a copy of Orbx software from any source other than flightsimstore.com or a previously authorised DVD reseller, whatever mechanism that was used to install that unauthorised copy of Orbx software was logged onto your Windows system somewhere.

 

The solution is to think back to that "try before you buy" Orbx product that was installed and then go and purchase an authorised license from flightsimstore.com for that and any other unauthorised products that may have been installed in the past.

 

So it matters not if you've purchased every single Orbx product including a few "try before I buy" copies in the past; you need to ensure 100% of your product installers come from FSS and if you have experienced an ORBX folder loss you will need to re-install Windows.

.

 

JV - I bought my FTX Australia DVD back in 2009 through fspilotshop.com. Are you telling me that if I were to run the latest Orbxlibs now - since that is not a FSS purchase - that that will crash my system and I will even have to install windows anew to get my FSX back up and running? Please tell me that I misunderstood you...

 

Cheers

 

Mallard

 

[John Venema]

9 minutes ago, Mallard said:

 

JV - I bought my FTX Australia DVD back in 2009 through fspilotshop.com. Are you telling me that if I were to run the latest Orbxlibs now - since that is not a FSS purchase - that that will crash my system and I will even have to install windows anew to get my FSX back up and running? Please tell me that I misunderstood you...

 

Cheers

 

Mallard

 

 

No, please use common sense

 

DVD installers were not copy protected at all, you simply auto-ran the DVD installer.

 

If you want to convert your old DVD purchases to the latest version-patched FSS installer download edition, we've been offering this for a small token fee since March 2014: http://www.orbxsystems.com/forum/topic/75513-fss-cross-grade-offer-for-all-orbx-dvd-customers-from-other-online-stores/

[Jack Sawyer]

Thanks for clarifying this John.  It's brilliant what you have done.  I can't STAND pirates.  I started in computers when I was in the UK in the Air Force in the early 1980's and I remember that's all people DID back then was pirate.  I hated it then and I hate it now.  Amazing how they can pirate and come here seeking advice, that takes a lot of nerve.  I stopped writing for this very reason.  Why do people think they have a right to digital media?

 

Now I'm going to go ahead and update as soon as I turn on the PC.

 

Personally, I love what your company has done.  I used to use another company's scenery and it looked lifeless, Orbx makes it look so real it amazes me when I fly.  I was told I'd have constant CTD's and OOM's if I went to Orbx but I have a powerful system and even the NGX with almost all sliders to the right and never get OOM's.

 

Anyway, sorry for the rant, I just wanted to say thanks to keep the leeches' hands off your products.  

[LarryA]

Very well put J.V.. It is my understanding in the Orbx Eula agreement after reading it several times. Orbx can be installed to either FSX or P3D not both. Orbx on one computer one installation not both applications.

 

The Demos is the best deal on the block. Then you can make an informed decision to purchase or not.

[Bruce Hamilton]

7 minutes ago, JS07 said:

Amazing how they can pirate and come here seeking advice, that takes a lot of nerve. 

 

I went into the support forum and read the entire merged topic about this, and some of these people who got busted have actually been here for some time.  One of those most vocal has over 2,000 posts, guess they just forgot about that one scenery they tried out now and bought later.

[Voyager]

In other words, this is good for good players: were awarded getting a good player certificate. Bad for whom played bad, no forgiveness, even if he has repented.

 

Well, Ulysses taught how to win a war in which force or stronger can do nothing! LoL

 

Congrats Mr. Venema!

 

Cheers,

Voyager

[dominique]

LM did a similar trick, not long ago, and a few of the Avsim regulars were caught their hands in the cookies jar  ! 

[Mallard]

OK - so I did misunderstand you *phew*

 

Thanks for clarifying this issue.

 

Cheers

 

Mallard

[HiFlyer]

Double post?

[HiFlyer]

 Ok, I'm an idiot. I know what the problem is now (well, I strongly suspect) and it's my fault. Now I'm not sure if I can fix it without yet another reinstall of windows.

 

Years ago, I needed to download some updated versions of scenery from the flightsim store. ( I can't even remember what they were at this point) and it was taking absolutely forever and the connection kept dropping, making me try again and again.

 

I eventually just got the files from a torrent (in record time, I might add) and figuring since I had legitimate copies, it would be fine,  I stored them and neatly labeled them alphabetically and forgot about the whole thing years (and years) ago.

 

I can't even remember what files they were, which means I will probably have to redownload every single one of my purchases, and probably reinstall windows.

 

Honestly, it's not worth it to me right now, just to satisfy idle curiosity, especially as I just got windows 10 working they want I want it to.  Since its very likely my fault I'm deleting all my orbx stuff since I just can't remember which files they were. Maybe someday, when I have lots and lots and lots and lots and lots (and lots) of time, I will redownloaded it all and try again, but right now, the thought is just depressing.

 

Sorry. If this hadn't happened, I probably would never even have remembered the incident)

[olli4740]

By fighting piracy you keep product prices within reasonable bounds and you ensure continued development of really amazing addons. Thank you for that.

[dominique]

15 minutes ago, HiFlyer said:

 Ok, I'm an idiot. I know what the problem is now (well, I strongly suspect) and it's my fault. Now I'm not sure if I can fix it without yet another reinstall of windows.

 

Years ago, I needed to download some updated versions of scenery from the flightsim store. ( I can't even remember what they were at this point) and it was taking absolutely forever and the connection kept dropping, making me try again and again.

 

I eventually just got the files from a torrent (in record time, I might add) and figuring since I had legitimate copies, it would be fine,  I stored them and neatly labeled them alphabetically and forgot about the whole thing years (and years) ago.

 

I can't even remember what files they were, which means I will probably have to redownload every single one of my purchases, and probably reinstall windows.

 

Honestly, it's not worth it to me right now, just to satisfy idle curiosity, but at this point I am deleting all my orbx stuff. Maybe someday, when I have lots and lots and lots and lots and lots (and lots) of time, I will redownloaded it all and try again, but right now, the thought is just depressing.

 

Sorry. If this hadn't happened, I probably would never even have remembered the incident)

 

I don't doubt your sincerity but those who run Torrent sites are scum, often mafia-type criminals I believe. Not your retarded teens as often thought. Using their facilities because an honest site is down makes them endure and that is depressing, my friend, not that you have  to reload your stuff.

 

[mopperle]

Quote

I eventually just got the files from a torrent (in record time, I might add) and figuring since I had legitimate copies, it would be fine

[Benny]

This doesn't concern me at all, only the title did

 

Ben

[Bruce Hamilton]

30 minutes ago, HiFlyer said:

I eventually just got the files from a torrent (in record time, I might add) and figuring since I had legitimate copies, it would be fine

Not too many years ago, JV was hosting a "Wall of Shame" on this forum of people who thought just that, "I've bought it, so I'll download it!"

[HiFlyer]

10 minutes ago, mopperle said:

 

Easy to laugh, but My memory is of attempting to download several times, going to sleep and finding the download had dropped. and it happened over the course of several days.

 

Honestly, when I found another way to get my files, I was very happy, and they served me well until I got tired of FSX and deleted it all.

 

Maybe I'll get banned or something, but at least I got my doggone files. It was to avoid things like that that I gave up on Orbx, and only the hope that that was past is what made me try again.

[mopperle]

Somebody must be very naive to believe that downloading something from a torrent site is legal.

There are other ways to share files legally with friends.

;)

[jerdoo]

11 minutes ago, HiFlyer said:

 

Easy to laugh, but My memory is of attempting to download several times, going to sleep and finding the download had dropped. and it happened over the course of several days.

 

Indeed

TPB=illegal file sharing and it doesn't matter what you say or do it will always be

[DesertPilot]

1 hour ago, LarryA said:

Very well put J.V.. It is my understanding in the Orbx Eula agreement after reading it several times. Orbx can be installed to either FSX or P3D not both. Orbx on one computer one installation not both applications.

 

Actually, JV posted months ago, that Orbx would turn a blind eye to parallel installations of Orbx products into multiple versions of FSX and P3D, as long as they all reside on the same computer.  In fact, the latest Orbx installers (with P3Dv3 support) even support installing into concurrent boxed FSX and Steam FSX installations.

 

When installing into multiple computers, then yes, Orbx requires a separate license for each computer.

 

Found JV's post on parallel installations on same PC: http://www.orbxsystems.com/forum/topic/94456-question-about-licenses/?do=findComment&comment=857676

[HiFlyer]

1 minute ago, mopperle said:

Somebody must be very naive to believe that downloading something from a torrent site is legal.

There are other ways to share files legally with friends.

;)

 

My last post till I move on, but torrents are legal and useful. I purchased a membership from a site to download the X-plane hi-res freeware, only to find the site was hammered and getting the files was HORRIBLE. I had paid for faster download and got nothing. Luckily, users organized torrents (with the creator's blessing) and I finally got what I had paid for. There are also several freeware files that creators sometimes don't have good fast hosting for, (like the FSX hawaiian freeware) and so they use torrents instead. Now, even though I don't need to, I host those torrents, so others don't have to go through what I did. (shrug)

 

You may now proceed to kill me but I've already admitted my error, and will consider anything more to be just piling on. (we do that)

[pmb]

1 hour ago, LarryA said:

Very well put J.V.. It is my understanding in the Orbx Eula agreement after reading it several times. Orbx can be installed to either FSX or P3D not both. Orbx on one computer one installation not both applications.

 

The Demos is the best deal on the block. Then you can make an informed decision to purchase or not.

John, could you, perhaps make this point clear once and for all.

 

I had several ORBX sceneries installed into FSX:SE, Prepar3d2.5, Prepard3d3 in parallel some time ago, all legally bought from the FSS and installed with proper installers. Was this illegal indeed?

 

I got rid of FSX:SE now but still have ORBX sceneries (as far as they are compatible) installed into Prepar3d2.5 and 3, and strictly speaking these are two installations. Will I have to deinstall them from Prepar3d2.5 to use them in Prepar3d3? Given there are no ORBX Airports available in Prepar3d3 I need Prepar3d2.5 for the Airports and the corresponding Regions for embedding them. On the other hand, I would really like to install at least the Regions with new installers as they become available in Prepar3d3. 

 

Thanks and kind regards, Michael

[FlavioSSA]

Let´s remember people, what´s wrong is using torrent trackers like TPB and of course downloading their ilegal content.

Using TORRENT P2P protocol IS NOT ILEGAL (DCS, Microsoft and other vendors use them a lot) and thus it´s perfectly normal to have utorrent or similar installed in someone computer. I´m saying this because someone implied above that a desktop screen with a utorrent icon means that the guy is pirating stuff.