Disappearing ORBX folder? Read on ...

[Bruce Hamilton]

16 minutes ago, Michael Copp said:

Alex, am I to understand that this crack is a "generic" crack that can be used on a number of Orbx products?

 

The "crack" he's talking about is how hackers break the installer to run without credentials, why are we discussing it?

[Alex Goff]

26 minutes ago, Michael Copp said:

 

Alex, am I to understand that this crack is a "generic" crack that can be used on a number of Orbx products?

 

 

 

The exploit we have targeted is not a stand-alone cracker, it is the exploit included in most pirated Orbx installers floating around. So if one were to download a cracked installer and use it, that exploit is probably the one that will be applied.

[fotooleg]

 John  You are just gorgeous!

I bought 13 products ORBX.

I have just bought :

FTX: EU Norway  FSS0424468

and  FTX: Trees HD FSS0424468 .

Apparently they spoiled folder ORBX...

It was my old mistake (  torrents ).

It would be good if you paid attention to to Eastern Europe.

(And a little Russian ).

Thank you very much!

[Gent]

First I have purchased all of the Orbx products I use. However I have upgraded my computer with new ones a few times and given the old ones to family members. After reading this thread, I became concerned that I may not have uninstalled all the products even though I try to each time. I also have p3d v2.5, v3, fsx, and fsx steam. I decided to go ahead and uninstall all Orbx from everything else before I install Orbx into V3, then I would know how to tell my son how to double check to be sure the old computer was clean.

 

i did a forum search for uninstall as I could not find an uninstall program for regions or airports or vector only global. I found a couple of faqs that involved deleting individual scenery files in a bunch of folders.

 

If you want to change computers is there not a comprehensive uninstall program to delete all Orbx files and registry entries? Surly there must be an easy way to comply with the single computer requirement?

 

i am not complaining about the process or requirements rather just trying to be sure I comply when changing computers.

 

 

 

 

[Ed Correia]

You can repair FSX and P3D installations with their repair functions if the concern is about corrupting installations. 

I assure you that LM and DTG take the same view of piracy and if approached their comment would most likely be "tell someone who cares". The steps we have taken are not haphazard but targets unique known hack combinations that will only exist if you use these pirated copies. 

 

This Orbxlibs targeted a handful of known registry hacks and torrent sites are already posting instructions on how to circumvent them. As they continue to publicly make their intentions known we will continue to thwart those steps. Pretty soon pirated copies will not be able to have an Orbxlibs version installed which will render many parts of the scenery unusable and in some instances crash their sim. 

[Argharg]

hello;

 

Just bought a new PC; can I reinstall my numerous Orbx Scene on this one? Do I need to remove them first from the old one? Paid for all of them obviously.

Also; thinking of moving from good old FSX to P3D v3, how do I do that? I reload the appropiate scenarios and reinstall? Do I need to repay?

 

Etienne

[jmorvay1971]

1 minute ago, Ed Correia said:

You can repair FSX and P3D installations with their repair functions if the concern is about corrupting installations. 

I assure you that LM and DTG take the same view of piracy and if approached their comment would most likely be "tell someone who cares". The steps we have taken are not haphazard but targets unique known hack combinations that will only exist if you use these pirated copies. 

 

This Orbxlibs targeted a handful of known registry hacks and torrent sites are already posting instructions on how to circumvent them. As they continue to publicly make their intentions known we will continue to thwart those steps. Pretty soon pirated copies will not be able to have an Orbxlibs version installed which will render many parts of the scenery unusable and in some instances crash their sim. 

Ed,

 

I do find it utterly fascinating that there are people out there bound and determined to hack flight simulator scenery.  I can think of a whole slew of games and other high end software that would be more worthy of their time than this (no offense).  So if they are actively circumventing ORBX's new safeguards (they need a new hobby), and you folks counter them with something new, when will it end.

 

I learned long ago that the most dangerous person is the one with nothing left to lose.  Has John and the team discussed a more fool-proof method for delivering software that impenetrable?  Has anyone thought about a subscription based system where by the consumer needs specific log in credentials or one time pass codes?  I know, that sounds excessive and probably expensive on your end.

 

I guess I am a little surprised that it took this long for ORBX to combat this issue.

 

-Jim

[Triplane]

1 hour ago, Gent said:

First I have purchased all of the Orbx products I use. However I have upgraded my computer with new ones a few times and given the old ones to family members. After reading this thread, I became concerned that I may not have uninstalled all the products even though I try to each time. I also have p3d v2.5, v3, fsx, and fsx steam. I decided to go ahead and uninstall all Orbx from everything else before I install Orbx into V3, then I would know how to tell my son how to double check to be sure the old computer was clean.

 

i did a forum search for uninstall as I could not find an uninstall program for regions or airports or vector only global. I found a couple of faqs that involved deleting individual scenery files in a bunch of folders.

 

If you want to change computers is there not a comprehensive uninstall program to delete all Orbx files and registry entries? Surly there must be an easy way to comply with the single computer requirement?

 

i am not complaining about the process or requirements rather just trying to be sure I comply when changing computers.

 

 

 

 

 

If the main sim folder(s) ( FSX P3D) are still on the old computer just tell your son to delete that folder. The ORBX folder will be deleted along with it and everything will then be OK. If for some reason you want to leave the sim folders just delete the ORBX folder...don't worry about the Registry entries and the other related minor folders.

 

Doug

[Orbxtreme]

What is the dry mouth syndrome? When you know all you have is legal but that if Orbx made a mistake you end up having to reinstall hundreds of programs. Before I pressed the new Orblibs version, I must admit I paused few seconds, hoping that their program would not screw everything I took so much time to install with years. And when I did press that button, my system told me that I had a problem. Hearth attack!! But it was with a third provider called fs.insider.com, something about an Object flow file...I am too old for that !! But at least, everything works fine!

[Bassman]

Presuming all the above and without prejudice, I did download Global V1 to see it's effect on Australia (demo regions are quite recent and Australia has not been updated for many years and quality has fallen behind latest Orbx developments in scenery).  Is one able to now re-install only those products actually purchased from FSS (Order numbers were part of my signature)? This is what I did on my recent re-install where I only installed Australia purchased however rightly or wrongly I am still suffering the penalty.

[Penzoil3]

Bassman;

John said that if this got you, you have to reformat and reinstall a clean operating system. Otherwise the telltale is in the registry, and it will just happen again.

 Sue

[Bassman]

Sorry Penzoil, I thought he meant a full re-install in FSX; a full re-install of the OS is a punishment well in excess of the crime.

[MrUnSavory1]

Wait, let me get the gist if this post. You are calling me a pirate? I was one of the ones who got their folder deleted and I can assure you I have no pirated software. You have a lot of damn nerve. I guess I should not expect a large company to own up to their mistakes. If I have illegal software I got it from FSS. No more ORBX for me. I will not give my money to a company that insults me and moves on their way. I know you wont care, that's how big business is.

[Bassman]

I wish to maintain a more conciliatory tone in my post. As an example of my "integrity" all my Orbx except Global (for the reason explained and mia culpa) has been purchased. I could bore you with all the FSS numbers but you can check on FFS store.

Blue, Gold, Green, Red, SP4.003, England, Scotland, Wales, Ireland, Norway, NZSI, NZNI, Trees and many others (if I was a habitual hacker why on earth would I pay for a small product like trees? why,  because I am not a habitual hacker).  Anyway, a "life sentence" for stealing a loaf of bread as probably how my family got to Australia in the first place.

[jmorvay1971]

*facepalm*

 

Just as I feared...everyone has achieved paranoia.  If I am to leave anyone something to take away from this, it's this:

 

"The truth has nothing to hide"

 

We should all try to calm down.  The way I see it, if every time someone came along, trying to call me out on something I didn't do and subsequently send me to crazytown, I'd have to get my mail forwarded.

 

-Jim

[jaseman007]

Some of the responses and defence listed in this topic just amazes me.

 

Simple fact.  If you legitimately bought the product, agreed to the EULA and installed correctly you won't have an issue.

 

Second fact - if your folders been wiped you've been caught out.  Just admit it, you've been caught.  See you back here after 90 days with a clean install of your system and fully paid/receipted ORBX software.

 

Well done to JV and the extended team.  They work too hard to have to put up with software pirates.

 

Jas

[Benny]

1 hour ago, MrUnSavory1 said:

Wait, let me get the gist if this post. You are calling me a pirate? I was one of the ones who got their folder deleted and I can assure you I have no pirated software. You have a lot of damn nerve. I guess I should not expect a large company to own up to their mistakes. If I have illegal software I got it from FSS. No more ORBX for me. I will not give my money to a company that insults me and moves on their way. I know you wont care, that's how big business is.

 

Well, if it's true ÉI'm sure the staff will help you resolve that

 

ORBX is small, very small in the land of software.

 

I don't think so

 

That I doubt it a lot, they are simply trying to protect themselve

 

The fact that you are reacting this way... is very strange!

 

Ben

 

[freddy]

I hate pirates.  I get ridiculed at work when I talk about legally purchasing software or movies. But I don't care if my colleagues ridicule me, because my conscience is clear.

 

I applaud companies such as ORBX for trying to protect their IP.  However, a concern I have is that it is not always possible to get it 100% right.  As someone who works in IT (and has experience writing software installers) I know that sometimes innocent people can fall foul of even the most rigorously tested code. The post from "MrUnSavory1" above highlights this, stating that he had his folder deleted despite the fact that he has all legally purchased software installed. If that is true, then it is a harsh "punishment" for him to have to do a full reinstallation of his OS, if he again wants to continue to use and enjoy ORBX products.

 

In short, I give kudos that you are trying to stop the pirates and protect your IP, but, at the same time, I also think it can be a bit "risky" to assume that your installer(s) will always get it right.  I can see why people could have paranoia.

 

 

[Perk]

9 hours ago, John Venema said:

But, having the µTorrent client app icon on your desktop is really giving the game away since most legitimate uses of the BT protocol negate the need for such client apps.

 

 

I beg to differ.  I've got uTorrent running now seeding Falcon BMS 4.33...  Especially for people with hobbies like flight simulation where there are thousands of mods for dozens of sims, a Bittorrent client is a common and useful tool.

I fully support developers eating on a regular basis (despite a job where I spend most of the day arguing with them =), but there are many legitimate uses for a lot of powerful tools.  Nmap can be used for "hacking", but it's something I use daily on my company's network for a multitude of reasons.  Encryption can be used by terrorist organizations to obscure their communications, but it also allows me to buy Orbx software with a credit card.  Simply being in possession of a tool shouldn't be an indication that the tool has been used improperly.

[wombat]

Great guys, just keep doing what you guys do best and protect it any way you can

[Sammy H]

11 hours ago, Bruce Hamilton said:

 

I went into the support forum and read the entire merged topic about this, and some of these people who got busted have actually been here for some time.  One of those most vocal has over 2,000 posts, guess they just forgot about that one scenery they tried out now and bought later.

 

Bruce, I will just assume you were talking about me?  So, now that my work day is over cause I actually have a job that requires me to be there to defend peoples freedom so that they can sit here and post in this forum.   This also doesn't ALLOW me to sit in front of my computer and these forums all day to defend my view of things.

 

First and foremost, I have been a loyal member of ORBX and a huge supporter of their work for as long as I can remember not to include that I am well known and VERY well respected person in the sim community and have been for over 12 years.  I promote their products, I talk about them with fellow simmers who have never even heard of the company, I have on many occasions contributed to the forums as Bruce so nicely pointed out which over half of those are helping fellow simmers out and supporting our love for simming and the Aviation community on a whole.  Making wonderful comments supporting the hard work of the Dev which I'm ALWAYS giving praise to, just recently an exchange of post between Jarrod and myself giving praise for such great work, not to include floating there support banners in many other forums across the sim community which I am a part of.  Now to say that I have personally downloaded/pirated an illegal copy of anything is ridiculous.  Everyone here has the right to their opinion, say what you want no skin off my back.  But the fact of the matter is I am not the only one who Sims in my household and specifically I am not the only one who uses this computer.  I have two sons who have their own profiles, their own Sims installed on those profiles which all of this is tied to one computer.  My sim installs are legit across the board, if they have been pirating anything well now it will come out when I talk with them.  Obviously I am highly pissed off about this since if they did it corrupted my sim which pisses me off to no end.  I am in the Military which anyone who has ever served their country knows requires a lot of you and requires you to be away from home for long hours on a daily basis.  So I cannot just sit here over their shoulders and watch what they are doing 24/7.  One is 18 and the other is 16 and they are at the age of doing stuff like that just like some other teens and adults around the world, I will deal with them accordingly.  However, to claim that everyone's instance was wrong, or incorrect, illegal or anything else of that nature without giving ample time for them to defend themselves is quite disturbing. Especially in my case given for those who know me and know how much I am an advocate for not on the sim community but aviation in general.

 

I give all the respect in the world to JV, ORBX, and all the other Dev as I ALWAYS do.  I am glad that they decided to do this without question and had I known that another profile or perhaps something my sons have done to there Sims could corrupt my stuff OBVIOUSLY I would like to think I am pretty smart and would not of made such an lashed out post wondering what had happened.  Clearly I would of dealt with that situation in-house instead of BLAMING ORBX for corrupting my install.  I have been in the community long enough and have been around the block and back up the street so I think I would of used common sense in this situation, it was clearly obvious I had no idea what was being done on my machine.

 

Am I mad for anyone voicing their opinion in here, without question no.  I want to voice mine but it seems I am in the wrong according to everyone here so please feel free to do as you please JV and the rest of the Dev team from ORBX.  I know the products I have bought, the amount of money I have spent not only here but in the sim community in general just recently purchasing another ORBX product and donating to the OZx site less than 5 days ago.  I have sons who make their own money and do their own thing on their profiles unfortunately which is tied to my computer cause it is the best for gaming.  Unfortunately, I cannot be home 24/7 since the Military does depend on me to show up every day for work.  If you all feel the need to ban me for 90 days then so be it but the one thing I cannot stand is those who want to call people out and don't have all the facts.  When you do have all the facts then feel free if the situation warrants it. 

 

Just my .02$

 

 

[Michael Copp]

2 hours ago, jaseman007 said:

Some of the responses and defence listed in this topic just amazes me.

 

I know, right? Here's another wild one - I fessed up to downloading a torrent six years ago to try out (AU RED, I believe it was), proceeded to buy over 70 Orbx products since then, and my reward was to just today get banned from the support forums for three months!!!!! That sounds fair don't you think, Jay-Z Man?????

 

 

[jaseman007]

8 minutes ago, Michael Copp said:

 

I know, right? Here's another wild one - I fessed up to downloading a torrent six years ago to try out (AU RED, I believe it was), proceeded to buy over 70 Orbx products since then, and my reward was to just today get banned from the support forums for three months!!!!! That sounds fair don't you think, Jay-Z Man?????

 

 

So you're a pirate?  You've just admitted to stealing AU Red from ORBX........ It doesn't matter if you did it 10 years ago, 6 years ago or yesterday!!!

 

You stole it mate.  You're a thief and now you're paying the penalty.

 

Jas

[wombat]

Here we go

5 minutes ago, jaseman007 said:

So you're a pirate?  You've just admitted to stealing AU Red from ORBX........ It doesn't matter if you did it 10 years ago, 6 years ago or yesterday!!!

 

You stole it mate.  You're a thief and now you're paying the penalty.

 

Jas

 

[jaseman007]

Just now, Michael Copp said:

 

Jay-Z Mannnnnnn!!!!!! So self-righteous - I can only hope to aspire to your Pinnacle of Pureness!

 

Perhaps I will attain your level of hand-cleanliness during my three months in the support-lacking wilderness...

 

Yeah I hope so too.

 

Enjoy.

 

Jas

[Ben972]

I bought my pc has a family member who had installed FSX and I suppose many addons.
Am I responsible for the acts of the person who possessed the pc before me?
I formatted and reinstalled windows after the recent problem of suppression.
I reinstalled P3D V3 and all my 15 products currently compatible and no problem deleting

[GordonGekko]

3 hours ago, ftp2leta said:

 

Well, if it's true ÉI'm sure the staff will help you resolve that

 

ORBX is small, very small in the land of software.

 

I don't think so

 

That I doubt it a lot, they are simply trying to protect themselve

 

The fact that you are reacting this way... is very strange!

 

Ben

 

 

Agreed.  Kind of funny and ironic his user name is MrUnSavory. Unsavory people sometimes make unsavory decisions when it comes to acquiring savory software.

[GordonGekko]

7 hours ago, Michael Copp said:

 

...although, I still have some concern that potentially corrupting a users third-party software installation (that is to say, a software modification that intrudes into the EULA of Microsoft, Dovetail, Lockheed-Martin et al), may start to get pretty murky pretty quick when it comes to what's legal and what's essentially a Trojan.

 

 

 

No need to be concerned about what ORBX does, let them worry about that. It's not our responsibility to worry about what they do to protect themselves. As long as we do the right thing by purchasing their software and not stealing it, what happens to other people who don't play by the rules shouldn't be our concern. The only ones concerned are the ones who made past mistakes and are now worrying about it, as they should be.

[GordonGekko]

10 hours ago, Michael Copp said:

 

Regardless, I do think it's a little heavy-handed to have the application delete legitimately paid-for software, especially if that broadsword vs. scalpel approach ends up completely corrupting the users FSX/Prepar3d installation.

 

Perhaps going after you in a court of law for having stolen their software at some point would have been not as heavy handed? If I was a pirate, I'd consider their method as getting off the hook pretty easy considering the possible alternatives.

[rick66]

Just a reminder with the Australian Data Retention Laws that any software piracy you obtain online from users inside Australia and even with software to mask your ip will be tracked and passed on to the software owners, that in a sense would be a huge deterrent for anyone here wanting to take that road and end up in court over $30....

[Argharg]

8 hours ago, Triplane said:

 

If the main sim folder(s) ( FSX P3D) are still on the old computer just tell your son to delete that folder. The ORBX folder will be deleted along with it and everything will then be OK. If for some reason you want to leave the sim folders just delete the ORBX folder...don't worry about the Registry entries and the other related minor folders.

 

Doug

Hi Doug;

 

To be clear; I have one PC ( the old one that I am planning to retire but not yet ) with FSX and lots of fully paid Orbx scenarios on it an no illegal ones. (almost of all them )

Just bougth a new PC and would like to "restart" on P3D v3. ( they stand side by side and share the same monitor )

Do I need to remove the old Orbx folder to be able to start install the P3D version on the new PC? that would be a shame.

 

Etienne

[moonman]

16 hours ago, Mallard said:

 

JV - I bought my FTX Australia DVD back in 2009 through fspilotshop.com. Are you telling me that if I were to run the latest Orbxlibs now - since that is not a FSS purchase - that that will crash my system and I will even have to install windows anew to get my FSX back up and running? Please tell me that I misunderstood you...

 

Cheers

 

Mallard

 

 

16 hours ago, John Venema said:

 

No, please use common sense

 

DVD installers were not copy protected at all, you simply auto-ran the DVD installer.

 

If you want to convert your old DVD purchases to the latest version-patched FSS installer download edition, we've been offering this for a small token fee since March 2014: http://www.orbxsystems.com/forum/topic/75513-fss-cross-grade-offer-for-all-orbx-dvd-customers-from-other-online-stores/

 

Thank You very much for clarifying!

 

[Bassman]

To those worried about being banned. Cop it on the chin; show some contrition: don't make stupid excuses; LEARN from the experience and if the offence is minor I strongly doubt that you will be banished.

[Metthos]

What make us civilized is that the law applies to everyone, and crime must be punished by the authorities, not the victims.
It is not ORBX to decide what the punishment should be. Instead, you should report violations and request action by the authorities.

 

To compare this to the authorities withdrawal of the right to drive is to compare ORBX rights to punish with the right of the authorities.

Implanting a program that make changes (Virus) in another person's computer without their permission is not legal and it is not about reclaiming stolen copyright.

 

I can understand ORBX frustration over piracy of their products and no thief will report ORBX of crime, because it's a recognition of their own crimes.
But be careful so that no innocent suffer of your virus.

 

What surprises me is that ORBX do not protect their work better. There are much more effective protection available if you want, eg. similar to that the FSDreamTeam use.

[Matthew Kane]

I have nothing to worry about here (happy ORBX customer)  

[chumley]

7 hours ago, jaseman007 said:

So you're a pirate?  You've just admitted to stealing AU Red from ORBX........ It doesn't matter if you did it 10 years ago, 6 years ago or yesterday!!!

 

You stole it mate.  You're a thief and now you're paying the penalty.

 

Jas

Sometimes it is better to shut up and let the situation calm down rather than throw an incendiary into the mix as you have done.

 

I understand and accept the ORBX  stance on protecting their IP but I think it would have been far better to wipe out the ORBX folder if that was considered the best course of action and to have a solution that did not require the full re-installation of the OS as additional punishment say in the form of an ORBX proprietary 'magic bullet' that could be issued when the mea culpa had been offered.

[John Venema]

42 minutes ago, Metthos said:

What make us civilized is that the law applies to everyone, and crime must be punished by the authorities, not the victims.
It is not ORBX to decide what the punishment should be. Instead, you should report violations and request action by the authorities.

 

To compare this to the authorities withdrawal of the right to drive is to compare ORBX rights to punish with the right of the authorities.

Implanting a program that make changes (Virus) in another person's computer without their permission is not legal and it is not about reclaiming stolen copyright.

 

I can understand ORBX frustration over piracy of their products and no thief will report ORBX of crime, because it's a recognition of their own crimes.
But be careful so that no innocent suffer of your virus.

 

What surprises me is that ORBX do not protect their work better. There are much more effective protection available if you want, eg. similar to that the FSDreamTeam use.

 

Of course it's our right to remove our intellectual property from the PC of someone who has stolen our software; why would you assume that is not our prerogative? It is certainly not a 'virus' because it does not harm your PC in a malicious way at all (it removes a single folder). Trust me, there are developers on the Orbx team who wanted us to go a lot further with deleting (such is their anger) but that is not our place to do, nor is that ethical. We are merely protecting and being custodians of *our* software, nothing less, nothing more.

 

Nobody 'innocent' has suffered, we're not amateurs.

 

Of course we can choose what punishment to impose. In fact a three month support ban is quite moderate actually, we could go much further if we wanted to - for example a permanent ban, IP ban, forwarding details to AVSIM so they get banned there, send details to authorities, etc etc.

 

As for using a much more intrusive copy-protection system, that is not what we want to impose on our customers.

 

[pmb]

1 hour ago, Metthos said:

What surprises me is that ORBX do not protect their work better. There are much more effective protection available if you want, eg. similar to that the FSDreamTeam use.

Heaven forbid. You probably know the crowd of users on the FSDreamTeam forum complaining about missing airport buildings in FSDT/FB sceneries because of Antivirus interfering or whatever causes.

 

In my opinion, the ORBX/FSS protection is very well-thought and much more easy to use,

 

Kind regards, Michael

 

 

 

 

[Matthew Kane]

I agree the wrappers/installers that FSS use work fine, consider the large volume of ORBX stuff a lot of us purchase the wrappers/installers are not that difficult to use, If the process was more difficult it would take that much more time to reinstall the 50 to 100 ORBX titles that some of us have accumulated over the years (legitimately) 

[allan prewett]

Just a quick NOOB question; this ORBX folder, what are you talking about?

Where is it, to see if its there/ not there?

 

Thanks

Allan