announcement Introducing Stripe Checkout - the 2-Click purchase option for OrbxDirect

[John Venema]

To make the process of using your credit or debit cards even more secure and much quicker, we have added a new feature to OrbxDirect.

 

It's called Stripe Checkout. Our website simply calls a pre-built component that Stripe has made, and they take care of the whole payment form for us. Then, on the server side, we use almost the exact same code as before to process the payment.

 

The advantage of using this is that it comes with a  [x] remember me checkbox. If you enter in your email address and you have already saved your details on any website that uses Stripe Checkout, then your details are saved.

 

On subsequent purchases in the same session, you will be able to purchase a product in two clicks!: 

 

If the session has ended (or you are purchasing from another computer), you will be sent a unique code to the phone number you entered when you were saving your card details: 

After each of those videos above, the transaction would be processed on the server side and then your card will be charged and then redirected to the "purchase complete" page.

 

NOTE: AT NO POINT DOES ORBX OR ORBXDIRECT STORE OR CAPTURE YOUR CREDIT OR DEBIT CARD INFORMATION.

 

It is entirely controlled by the Stripe module that we call from our website. It is totally 100% secure and there is no chance of your card details being compromised.

 

We hope this new faster way to complete transactions makes it even easier for your to use OrbxDirect.

[gregmorin]

Thanks John,

 

I will try it when you release LOWI.

 

Greg

[Mallard]

As far as I can see you will still need a credit card at some point in the transaction..?

 

Cheers

 

Mallard

[Nick Cooper]

Quote

To make the process of using your credit or debit cards even more secure and much quicker, we have added a new feature to OrbxDirect.

 

[Mallard]

OK - so that still leaves the large percentage of (especially German) potential buyers without a CC out of the game...

 

Thanks for the clarification, Nick

 

Cheers

 

Mallard

[Ripcord]

 

I am on the fence.  I would like to know what Stripe offers the consumer, in terms of protection and currency change fees.  Everything they advertise online is directed exclusively at the developer.  In fact, Stripe seems to want to avoid taking a consumer-facing position altogether -- they want to be completely behind the scenes, behind the storefront.

 

Paypal would provide a degree of protection against fraudulent charges and they would not charge for currency conversion, beyond the stated exchange rate (as below).

Exchange rate

$25.30 USD = $32.95 AUD

1 US Dollar = 1.3 Australian Dollar

It is not clear to me that I will get any of these benefits with Stripe.  I really don't know what the hell I get with Stripe.  Stripe seems to pretty uninterested in advertising what, if anything, they will do for me as a consumer.  All I get is the promise that my credit card will be safe.

 

Am I just a moron?  Could be I am missing something obvious?

 

[Ripcord]

I suppose this answers my question above:

https://stripe.com/au/checkout/legal

 

General.

The Stripe Checkout service (“Stripe Checkout”) is technology that makes it easier for merchants on the Internet (“Merchants”) to collect payment from individuals like you. Stripe Checkout also makes it easy for you to store a credit card or debit card (“Payment Credentials”) with Stripe for use across the websites of Merchants who’ve chosen to enable it.

 

Our Role.

Stripe Checkout is a way of storing your Payment Credentials, but it doesn’t change anything else about your relationship with the Merchant you’re paying or your bank or credit card company. You are ultimately responsible for the purchases you make using Stripe Checkout. Also, the Merchant is the one responsible for providing you the goods or services that you purchase using Stripe Checkout, not Stripe. Stripe will use our reasonable efforts to keep your Payment Credentials secure.

 

 

So that is it. 

 

CC are kept secure (reasonable efforts, at least), and Stripe makes it easy for online merchants to collect from slobs like me.  Full stop.  No further benefits promised or implied.  Whatever you purchase is on you, not Stripes place/role to get into any of that.  If you got problems with fraud, or you got sold a bill of goods online, talk to your bank what issues your CC.  Same goes for foreign transaction fees.

 

Not particularly enamored with this, having had the luxury of PP, but it starting to look like this is going to be the new reality.

 

 

 

 

 

[DesertPilot]

 

Quote

...

Paypal would provide a degree of protection against fraudulent charges and they would not charge for currency conversion, beyond the stated exchange rate (as below).

Exchange rate

$25.30 USD = $32.95 AUD

1 US Dollar = 1.3 Australian Dollar

...

 

Paypal, at least for US customers, uses a "retail" foreign exchange rate that factors in an additional 2.5% fee.  This from https://www.paypal.com/us/selfhelp/article/Where-can-I-find-PayPal's-currency-exchange-rates-FAQ1976.  So in effect, the final price in USD that is displayed during the Paypal payment process (for US customers), includes that 2.5% fee.

 

Not that much less than the 3% fee that my CC issuer charged.  Also, I'm now very confident that OrbxDirect / FTX Central will actually deliver the promised goods, so I'm willing to hand over the funds via Sprite.

 

[chumley]

4 hours ago, Mallard said:

OK - so that still leaves the large percentage of (especially German) potential buyers without a CC out of the game...

 

Thanks for the clarification, Nick

 

Cheers

 

Mallard

It mentions DEBIT card as well. CC and DC are not one and the same.

[John Venema]

We are processing a lot of transactions on Stripe from Germany, so I'm wondering if the lack of credit/debit card situation is not being overstated?

 

DesertPilot has already shared his Stripe currency exchange results in the other topic:

 

 

[MikeFlight]

I'll be there. Currently I do not have a credit card, since it has already been hacked three times.
No Paypal, no purchases via internet. Too bad, I had looked forward to several sceneries of you.

[Ripcord]

 

Yes, Desert Pilot got a much better fx rate on his purchase than I got on mine most recent one using PP.  But he got charged the extra 3% foreign transaction fee from his cc.  Of course I realize that our transactions occurred a 2-3 weeks apart, so fx rates fluctuate a bit, but he came out ahead actually.  At worst it is a wash, taking the extra 3% fx charge into account.  So probably Desert Pilot is correct in assuming that PP just bakes that all into their fx rate calculations.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ripcord]

Hey John, look at this.  This is the AUD fx rate to the USD for the last month.

 

December 13 was the day you pulled the plug on PP.  I think you guys might have contributed to a bit of a drop in the Aussie dollar.  : )

 

 

 

 

 

[Mallard]

6 hours ago, chumley said:

It mentions DEBIT card as well. CC and DC are not one and the same.

I know that - I have a Visa Debit card myself now. But that is still more than the majority of Germans have. There the EC-Maestro card is the standard, which, allthough technically a debit card, pretty much is limited to cash withdrawals or direct payments through cardreader machines. Heck, I had major problems the first few times I came to Ireland and wanted to rent a car here. Without a "real" credit car that is pretty much impossible. Or even paying for a room in France (or filling up the tank of my car) was quite a gamble with only the EC-card at hand. At one point on a trip through France I was lucky to have had a Swiss mastercard at hand when I wanted to pay for a hotel room, because two of my German cards would not be accepted anywhere but at ATMs. In Germany itself there would have been no question at all that those cards would work everywhere and with everything...

 

I had friends regularly asking me to book flights on the low-cost carriers, as they didn't have a card and could not complete the booking transactions.

 

Of couse Orbx will have a number of transactions from Germany, it would be ridiculous to think that credit cards are not used there, but I still say they are losing out on an even larger customer base since paypal offers the link to ones bank account, and Stripe doesn't.

 

Cheers

 

Mallard

[FireRx]

 

56 minutes ago, MikeFlight said:

I'll be there. Currently I do not have a credit card, since it has already been hacked three times.
No Paypal, no purchases via internet. Too bad, I had looked forward to several sceneries of you.

Ditto :(.  Hope the resolution come soon so we can get back to the business adding sceneries. I have two on the list already, and I'm sure that list will grow. 

[Ripcord]

 

It will get resolved, but I am staring to get the feeling that PP isn't coming back.

[Deleted_today]

28 minutes ago, Ripcord said:

 

It will get resolved, but I am staring to get the feeling that PP isn't coming back.

 

+1

3 hours ago, Mallard said:

I know that - I have a Visa Debit card myself now. But that is still more than the majority of Germans have. There the EC-Maestro card is the standard, which, allthough technically a debit card, pretty much is limited to cash withdrawals or direct payments through cardreader machines. Heck, I had major problems the first few times I came to Ireland and wanted to rent a car here. Without a "real" credit car that is pretty much impossible. Or even paying for a room in France (or filling up the tank of my car) was quite a gamble with only the EC-card at hand. At one point on a trip through France I was lucky to have had a Swiss mastercard at hand when I wanted to pay for a hotel room, because two of my German cards would not be accepted anywhere but at ATMs. In Germany itself there would have been no question at all that those cards would work everywhere and with everything...

 

I had friends regularly asking me to book flights on the low-cost carriers, as they didn't have a card and could not complete the booking transactions.

 

Of couse Orbx will have a number of transactions from Germany, it would be ridiculous to think that credit cards are not used there, but I still say they are losing out on an even larger customer base since paypal offers the link to ones bank account, and Stripe doesn't.

 

Cheers

 

Mallard

 

Thats the situation here. My creditcard was hacked in the past. So now I only have a EC-Maestro card. I am used to pay with PayPal online esp. Steam, FLightsimstore, Simmarket, FSPilotshop etc.

My hope is, that PayPal is coming back.

 

Cheers Uwe

 

[sightseer]

I've never heard of Stripe before and Ive never heard them mentioned outside of these forums and I don't feel comfortable with them and I probably won't for many years.

 

PayPal is extremely well known and widely accepted and should be accepted.  Im sorry for the troubles you guys are having with PP but I need a better alternative than some company Ive never even heard of.

 

Im really not even positive a prepaid Visa would work.  I think it would.  Ive used them before and its always worked just fine but I hate trying to figure out what to do with remaining oddball balances.  Maybe you could sell OrbxDirect StoreBucks and if a prepaid Visa would work then I could just buy a $100 credit voucher or something.  Make sure the StoreBucks could have ANY value (like $43.89 to make up a difference on some future purchase)

 

It'd be so much easier with PayPal.

 

 

[John Venema]

http://ecommerce-platforms.com/articles/paypal-alternatives

 

Quote

Stripe is probably the most popular of all the PayPal alternatives, and you’ll notice that some ecommerce platforms state Stripe as their preferred payment processor. For example, Squarespace has been working with them for a long time. The whole point of Stripe is that it eliminates the need for a merchant account and gateway. Everything is handled by Stripe, from collecting payments to sending those payments to the bank. It’s one of the more streamlined alternatives out there and it’s no wonder so many platforms partner with them.

 

[Triplane]

 

There is NO WAY I will use any process that stores my CC information. It's just a disaster waiting to happen.........Doug

[Sniper31]

For anyone that thinks their bank account, CC account (if you have one), social media account, PP account, etc won't ever get hacked, you are living in Fantasy Land. It is a FACT nowadays that in the world we live, cyber warfare and hacking are here to stay. I know much more about this professionally than I can say here. If you want to live your life under a rock, and attempt to survive "Off the Grid" as it were, well then good luck enjoying todays technological world. The most EFFECTIVE means of combatting hacking and cyber attacks on your accounts, whatever they may be, is VIGILANCE. Routine, aggressive vigilance. You will eventually have your PII stolen, accounts hacked etc, so the best thing you can do is catch it when it happens and act accordingly. With flight simming having its very roots embedded in technology, and the internet, we are not going to get away from the evil doers and mischief causers. Better to watch for them, find them when they act, and take appropriate action. Every lock can be picked....just remember that. 

[John Venema]

I don't own or use credit cards. Over the past decade I have various debit card details stored with dozens of companies including Amazon, Microsoft, Apple, Oculus, Samsung, Google, Skype, Netflix, Sony, Spotify etc, and have monthly charges coming out from many other companies. I have never been hacked. My bank has put a stop on my card a few times when they suspected strange activity but it's usually taken a simple phone call to validate the charge.

 

Using a card on the internet is as natural as breathing and you should not fear it. 99% of banks will offer buyer protection, even on large purchases.

 

[Triplane]

With all respect John, any cyber-security expert will tell you that using a debit card on the internet is the probably worst payment alternative of them all.  Especially if the information is stored. I agree with Sniper31, everyone is going to get hacked sooner or later. Sure banks offer buyer protection. But, here in the USA, it can take weeks (or months) to get funds restored from a loss due to a fraudulent debit card transaction. Debit cards give direct access to your bank account - credit cards do not. The "bad guys" can withdraw ALL of the funds from your account with the press of a button if they have your debit card information. The worst that can happen with a credit card is that you end up with a disputed transaction. Like Sniper31 says vigilance is the key...but the problem with a debit card is that by the time you find the fraudulent transaction you're likely to be flat broke.  I'm glad to hear that you didn't have any information stored with Yahoo.  -  Doug

[tom2rific]

My account was hacked 4 years ago. Discovered when I went to make a withdrawal at an ATM and there were insufficient funds. Entering the bank (one of the big 4 here in Aus.) they informed me not only was my account empty but I was in debt for $460 ! They never saw it coming, allowed my account to be overdrawn and took 3 months to resolve and return all funds. I left them and joined a credit union straight after.....now use a debit card or paypal when available..so agree with Sniper31..it's not a matter if..but when it happens

tom

[Ripcord]

 

Just praying you get your cash flow situation straightened out with the PP folks.  Even if you don't bring back PP, I still hate that you are having to go through this.

 

 

 

 

 

[John Venema]

Too many cyber-security 'experts' and fear mongering going on here. Use common sense and use a reputable bank.

 

My debit card is linked to a low balance transaction account, not a savings account. The savings account has no cards attached to it at all.

 

Living your life with the conviction you're going to be hacked is defeatist and paranoid. You may as well not use the internet at all and go out and buy model aircraft at a hobby shop with cash.

[bernd1151]

2 hours ago, John Venema said:

Living your life with the conviction you're going to be hacked is defeatist and paranoid. You may as well not use the internet at all and go out and buy model aircraft at a hobby shop with cash.

+1

[bvdboomen]

John, you simply cannot force everyone to use a credit card.

I've already read a lot of messages here alone about hacked credit cards, and that makes me more opponent to it.

So I hope ORBX and Pay Pal will sort this out. It cannot be that a good online store like FSS for instance has no problems and ORBX does.

[John Venema]

I am not forcing anyone to do anything. However the team and I are getting a bit tired of the "no PayPal no Orbx" and "credit cards are evil" mantras being chanted here. That is basically BS.

 

While PP are withholding our money (and they show no sign of wanting to resolve this quickly), no amount of protesting is going to reinstate a payment gateway that severely disrupts our ability to do business. A factoid: most of the slack has already been taken up by Stripe so we are in a position now where were actually don't need PP anymore.

[Benny]

18 hours ago, Sniper31 said:

For anyone that thinks their bank account, CC account (if you have one), social media account, PP account, etc won't ever get hacked, you are living in Fantasy Land. It is a FACT nowadays that in the world we live, cyber warfare and hacking are here to stay. I know much more about this professionally than I can say here. If you want to live your life under a rock, and attempt to survive "Off the Grid" as it were, well then good luck enjoying todays technological world. The most EFFECTIVE means of combatting hacking and cyber attacks on your accounts, whatever they may be, is VIGILANCE. Routine, aggressive vigilance. You will eventually have your PII stolen, accounts hacked etc, so the best thing you can do is catch it when it happens and act accordingly. With flight simming having its very roots embedded in technology, and the internet, we are not going to get away from the evil doers and mischief causers. Better to watch for them, find them when they act, and take appropriate action. Every lock can be picked....just remember that. 

 

I like you Sniper, everything you say I am fully agreeing with, especially that post.

 

Let me in my best English summarize that in a few words:

 

Being scared of... being scared.

 

If I was in JV (and the team) shoes, I would react the same if my frigging money was hold by a bank, Paypal in that situation.

And thanks for the faster process... even if it was fun entering my CC info and see the small animation of the virtual card

 

Cheers, Ben

[Ziggy]

If you can't get a prepaid card or open a prepaid account (for some reason or another) just open another account at your bank get a visa debit (or whatever they offer) and use that as a type of "prepaid account",  if you're not comfortable using your main account, there are so many different alternatives, just gotta think outside the box a bit 

[banjoman1960]

how pay the extra cost for a extra bank acount,only to buy from orbx,for other paypal is fine,i think it was a very bad idea to go complete away from FSS,so you will lose custumers.

if you can ad a option were someone can buy stuff for me(as present?),than i can pay him...........i think when i give someone the login data to my acount,then i get problems.

 

 

[bvdboomen]

1 hour ago, John Venema said:

While PP are withholding our money (and they show no sign of wanting to resolve this quickly), no amount of protesting is going to reinstate a payment gateway that severely disrupts our ability to do business.

Like I wrote in another topic. This is exactly the situation I fully understand. If it was my money I would do the same.

ORBX and Pay Pal are both professionals, so I do hope you find a solution.

[Ripcord]

On ‎12‎/‎23‎/‎2016 at 8:18 AM, John Venema said:

A factoid: most of the slack has already been taken up by Stripe so we are in a position now where were actually don't need PP anymore.

 

Well, there it is, then. We have arrived.

 

Ok, nobody blames you for not wanting to do business with PP - at least not since you explained the situation, to your credit.  I was actually warming up to the idea of trying Stripe, using some form of limited electronic debit card -- yes I was going to go out of my way to set up payment arrangements just for ORBX.  But that was right up until you decided to label us all 'defeatist and paranoid'.  That isn't sitting well. 

 

Is this not a forum, where we discuss and exchange ideas and opinions?  I mean you are hosting the forum, so you get the benefit of the 'voice of the customer'.  I'm sorry, but there are valid concerns.  Ignore them if you want, but I just wish you would take a minute to cool off before you hit that submit reply button. 

 

Oh I'll probably cave in and get something anyway, at some point.  The quality of your product is just that good.  But not today. 

 

I used to like to do business with you, John.  It was easy and I felt good about support the overall effort and the brand.  Frankly now I feel something different, not even sure how to describe it.  This saddens me just a little bit.

 

 

 

[Ripcord]

On ‎12‎/‎22‎/‎2016 at 8:49 PM, Ripcord said:

 

Just praying you get your cash flow situation straightened out with the PP folks.  Even if you don't bring back PP, I still hate that you are having to go through this.

 

 

I still feel this way, still hoping you get it resolved soon.  Nobody should be going through this during the holidays.

 

[John Venema]

Yes it is a forum where customers can express their opinions, and we are a LOT more tolerant of allowing people to have their say these days.

 

So please allow us also to have our opinions about topics, which in this instance means I don't agree with the paranoia surrounding the use of credit and debit cards online, nor do I buy into the premise that without PP most customers won't buy from us, as has clearly been proved by the shift from PP to Stripe by the majority of you.

 

If my opinion offends you there's nothing I can do about that, sorry.

[Ripcord]

 

Actually I kinda share your opinion on a general level.  I could have lived without the derision, but it is your house, and I'm just a guest.

 

Honestly, from a risk management perspective, you actually DO need to live your life with the idea that you are going to be hacked at some point.  You should basically plan for it, and by that we simply need to have some basic steps in place to limit the damage.  You listed your method, others listed theirs.  Folks just need to be smart about it.

 

So it is all about COMMON SENSE -- as you stated, John.  Doesn't mean we are relegated to cash purchases at the hobby shop. 

 

 

 

 

[banjoman1960]

maybee sell also at FSS as before,it was good for all the jears......maybee not for the same price as your Store.............

everthing was OK before the change........even the Downloads work better.........

if the prices are higher,maybee i buy not as much,but better than nothing..........

or give a option that other can buy and give as a gift,then i can pay them............

if PP comes back,nice..........if not OK i can understand,but then i am out if there is no way...........

i have nearly all Orbx scenery,but yes i hate creditcards,i do no onlinebanking..........so for me PP is the only i use,i do not change to other.........

 

Have a Nice Christmas,

cheers Ralf

[bvdboomen]

For me it is simple: I'm not getting myself a new payment method just for ORBX alone if they drop Pay Pal.

It's still unbelievable that all other vendors don't have any issues with PP and ORBX does.

I like the idea of getting back to FSS for the time being while ORBX is sorting things out.

[Triplane]

On 12/23/2016 at 2:51 AM, John Venema said:

Too many cyber-security 'experts' and fear mongering going on here. Use common sense and use a reputable bank.

 

My debit card is linked to a low balance transaction account, not a savings account. The savings account has no cards attached to it at all.

 

Living your life with the conviction you're going to be hacked is defeatist and paranoid. You may as well not use the internet at all and go out and buy model aircraft at a hobby shop with cash.

 

Again with all due respect John, prior to my retirement I was in the IT business for almost 40 years. My son owns an international cyber-security company. I trust my experience and my son's advice on this issue. For anyone doubting the perils of a debit card on the internet a quick Google search is a good place to start. Most customers are not as aware as you and I. Buyer beware with using a debit card is sound advice. Maybe in your location is less of an issue. But here in the USA it should be a major concern. I can't speak for the rest of the world but buyer beware seems to be good advice.....Doug