fatal error after two hours flying

[hanss]

Hi all,

After two hours flying from LSGG to LIRF (Geneva to Rome-Fiumicino) with a Lancaster, I got just on final when the fatal error message showed.

Just before the crash, my elevator and rudder started to move erratically, it went almost out of control. Frame-rates were still around 30, though.

My guess is that this fatal error is caused by a cumulation of too much information over the two hours flying making the VAS limit to be reached. I did save the flight during the en-route phase, fortunately.

When I fly the Cessna 337 over the Pacific fjords I can fly more than two hours with no problem at all. Is that strange then?

 

This brings me to a few questions: is my guess a correct assumption? Is it because the not so new videocard, (GTX480)? Is it just because FSX is a 32bit program?

Would an upgrade of the video card help much or is it better to just wait for new developments in FSX type simulators to overcome this problem, 64 bits e.g.?

I am considering an upgrade, which is quite costly of course, and I would not like to come to the conclusion that the upgrade did not give much improvement.

If nothing can change the situation I will be limited to flying less that two hours, depending on the scenery and the aircraft, and have to save the flight en route and restart the program before continuing the flight. Quite a nuisance but it gives me time for a cup of coffee.

 

I would very much appreciate your views on this.

 

Regards

 

Hans

[John Dow]

32 bit program = limited computing availability = when a complex plane moves across complex scenery it will test it fully.

 

Not much you can do about it.  If you don't have FSUIPC you can purchase it and select autosave every minute or so... and it has the advantage of a low VAS chime when you're about to run out so you can choose the best moment to restart.

 

Also if you are running FSX from an SSD your loadup times should be under a minute or two shouldn't they?

[birdguy]

I agree with John.  The FSUIPC auto save feature is a life saver.  I have mine set to save every 60 seconds and save the last three.

 

Now, I've seen the term VAS mentioned in these forums but I don't know what it is.  I know what OOM means but not VAS.  Would someone please explain it to me?

 

Noel

[Stewart Hobson]

Here ya go, Noel:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtual_address_space

[stufer]

Hi Hans

 

I'm not convinced this is a VAS issue (Noel, VAS is Virtual Address Space and using this up can lead to OOMs if you go above 4gb).

 

You are flying a short distance over (I assume) Global textures. Even with Vector, Open LC and a mesh, that surely won't go above the 4gb limit will it?

 

What does the error message say exactly when it crashes?

 

You mention that you were getting erratic controller movement prior to it crashing so perhaps there is an issue with this. Could you try a different controller temporarily and see if that helps?

 

Cheers

Stu

[birdguy]

Thanks for the explanation of VAS.

 

Noel

[Doug Sawatzky]

I am on the same page as Stufer on this....if it was a VAS issue wouldn't you get an OOM error notification and then crash? Not sure, as I have never had an OOM...

 

 

Doug

[Bullfox]

The most practical solution is to save, exit and take a break after an hour and a half or so. This is a good solution for a variety of reasons and is certainly the simplest way to deal with the problem while you study up on system solutions to the problem. My personal untested theory is that with powerful systems users push the sliders full right and use up VAS faster than users with less powerful systems who have to compromise more on the sliders.

[NoLonger]

Another solution is to switch to P3D v3 which seems to have solved a lot of VAS problems (better memory management which prevents the VAS from growing all the time until you get an OOM). I btw also doubt the OP had an OOM: you should get a very clear and obvious OOM message!

 

EDIT
A new video card won't help you with OOMs because the GPU memory has nothing to do with VAS.

[Doug Sawatzky]

To me the OP's issue sounds like a hardware overheat or a faulty RAM module....not an OOM...

[wolfko]

I'm with Stu and Doug. A "Fatal Error" message does not indicate an OOM. So IMO your problem has nothing to do with VAS.

[Stewart Hobson]

I am on the same page as Stufer on this....if it was a VAS issue wouldn't you get an OOM error notification and then crash? Not sure, as I have never had an OOM...

 

 

Doug

Hi, Doug.  That's exactly what happens.

 

Stew

[Stewart Hobson]

The most practical solution is to save, exit and take a break after an hour and a half or so. This is a good solution for a variety of reasons and is certainly the simplest way to deal with the problem while you study up on system solutions to the problem. My personal untested theory is that with powerful systems users push the sliders full right and use up VAS faster than users with less powerful systems who have to compromise more on the sliders.

I don't have OOMs that often--only once in the last 9 months, and for a couple of reasons which I don't need to go into here.  The one time I had an OOM, I saved the flight, quit FSX, then ran the sim again, loaded the saved flight and all was good.  I retrieved about 2.5 Gb of the VAS in doing so.  There was no need to wait the hour and a half.  I've also found that unnecessary switching back and forth between cockpit view and outside view does tend to eat up some VAS along the way.  Remaining in one view or the other for an extended length of time, I can see the VAS figure actually increase gradually to a "normal" level.  So FSX doesn't entirely "forget" to replenish its memory space--it just takes some time to do so, but even at that, it doesn't replenish it entirely to its previous level.

 

Stew

[NoLonger]

There was no need to wait the hour and a half.

LOL I thought the exact same as you did the first time I read his post but I think he meant to say the best thing to do is to save and quit FSX after you have flown for about an hour and a half, so well before an OOM occurs. No need to wait an hour and a half after saving and quitting indeed.

[Stewart Hobson]

LOL I thought the exact same as you did the first time I read his post but I think he meant to say the best thing to do is to save and quit FSX after you have flown for about an hour and a half, so well before an OOM occurs. No need to wait an hour and a half after saving and quitting indeed.

I merely took OP at his word...I guess you could be correct, though.  But usually my flights are completed well before an hour and a half, thus no OOMs.

 

Stew

[Bullfox]

Yep. If you get a crash after two hours, save and exit after about an hour and a half or so and take a break. Then reload and continue flying. That way you can continue flying without worry while you sort out the real problem.

Being an old guy, on long flights I usually save and exit and take a break before descent. That way I don't have to decide between peeing and landing.

[Stewart Hobson]

Yep. If you get a crash after two hours, save and exit after about an hour and a half or so and take a break. Then reload and continue flying. That way you can continue flying without worry while you sort out the real problem.

Being an old guy, on long flights I usually save and exit and take a break before descent. That way I don't have to decide between peeing and landing.

LOL!  If it comes to peeing or landing, I pause the sim, go pee, then come back and finish up. 

 

<Young guys are thinking:  What are they talking about?>

 

Stew

[Matthew Kane]

I do have FSUIPC but currently don't use it. What I do is save at Top Of Climb and Top Of Descend, also I restart FSX after I save at Top Of Descent. This works perfect for me because chances of an OOM is on approach or final but restarting FSX at Top Of Descend cleans the memory so the chances of an OOM on final is gone from my experience.

 

Everyone has their way and this is just mine.

[NoLonger]

We still aren't sure if the OP actually has OOMs and VAS problems...

Everyone has their way and this is just mine.

 

The best way to get rid of OOMs right now seems to be P3D v3!

[dominique]

Hey Hans

 

 

Don't let that 32/64bits mumbo-jumbo impresses you. Like others, I don't think you had a VAS problem except if the error message specifically says so.

 

 

Would an upgrade of the video card help much 

 

 

The painful truth is that your computer hardware is weak for FSX which demands a lot out of it. It means heat. It means errors. If your "fatal error" is one of the kind, I wouldn't worry too much. If it is repettive, the only solution is indeed to shorten your flights or to move to a better hardware.  It is more expensive than FSUIPC but certainly more useful !

 

Changing your video card is of a short if any benefit. With a i950 at 3.0GHz, going beyond a card of the 570 family would be a  total waste. Your card will pass most of its time waiting for the CPU .  You have to change everything, my friend.

 

 

 

 ? is it better to just wait for new developments in FSX type simulators to overcome this problem, 64 bits e.g.?

 

 

 No "new development" in FSX will help, they will make matter worse.  P3D which asks more from the GPU than FSX wil be the worse.

 

Hans, time to look hard at the calendar; Christmas is acomin' fast. And the Black Friday sales are just ahead .

[Matthew Kane]

 

The best way to get rid of OOMs right now seems to be P3D v3!

 

No you won't because all you are doing is increasing the envelope so that developers can push new limitations with things like 314 animated people on board a 777 boarding at the gate and watching movies in-flight and using the toilets at cruise altitude because.....As soon as you give a developer more resources guarantee they will use it up fully. Imagine what ORBX will do with scenery when they are able to push the envelope even further...

 

and then you get OOM's all over again because once again we are pushed to the limit, and the cycle continues. been going on since the early days of Atari in the 1970's so don't think for a second it is going to end...ever 

 

But I say bring it on because this is what keeps moving us forward year after year, isn't Flight Sim Fun 

[NoLonger]

No you won't because all you are doing is increasing the envelope so that developers can push new limitations with things like 314 animated people on board a 777 boarding at the gate and watching movies in-flight and using the toilets at cruise altitude because.....As soon as you give a developer more resources guarantee they will use it up fully. Imagine what ORBX will do with scenery when they are able to push the envelope even further...

 

and then you get OOM's all over again because once again we are pushed to the limit, and the cycle continues. been going on since the early days of Atari in the 1970's so don't think for a second it is going to end...ever 

 

But I say bring it on because this is what keeps moving us forward year after year, isn't Flight Sim Fun 

 

Very true, that's why I said 'right now'. I thought I posted something about this here but that was on Avsim LOL (I am getting old) but you are right: we get a bit of headroom now but history has proven that any room that is left open will be filled within no time by some developer. Nevertheless it's a good thing LM worked on better memory management before they switch to 64 bit, which is, I think, still a must. But... personally I don't think 64 bit will be the solution for all our problems (well, flighstim related problems ) because with all the memory available in 64 bit developers will start creating bigger add ons, maybe care less about keeping things small and within no time you will have add ons that are so heavy that it will bring any PC to a screeching halt. It is never going to end indeed. 

 

P.S. I did also post it here yesterday: http://www.orbxsystems.com/forum/topic/103714-havent-been-keeping-up-with-current-eventswhats-different-with-p3d-v3/?p=937532I am REALLY getting old LOL

[hanss]

Hi all,

Thank you very much for all the reactions.

 

I only got a fatal error message. The program has to shut down and restart or words to that effect.

I definitely did not see OOM messages. I experienced the steering problems before the crash also during the approach with a B-29 after a long flight. The fatal error then occurred when the plane was already on the runway; so the crew was saved

Switching views seemed a reason as well to me. I actually did that quite often as Rome was our holiday destination and I like to orient myself on the lay-out of the actual airport versus the FTX one. (no complaints about the scenery here, they are excellent in my opinion, by the way)

I have a liquid cooled computer, that should take care of the overheating, should it not? I also have FSUIPC and can use the last saved flight moment, have a pause and continue. What I get from your replies is that the amount of accrued data in the video card memory is then less than when I would have continued flying.

I think I went to the limit of my set-up. As my own message already indicates. In a way you are all confirming this to me. It is an expensive conclusion though.

May I sum up your advice and ask you whether I concluded rightly?

- Any new development in FSX, like P3Dv3 or 64 bit will not be the solution for my current set-up.

- Both a state of the art GPU and CPU will help, but still no guarantee as then the 32bit limit will be the next hurdle to take, though much more remote.

- SSD to run FSX from. Which I don't have at the moment.

- Pause after 1 to 1,5 hours flying and a complete restart will help to overcome the problem with the current set-up.

What is meant by OP, by the way?

Would crowd funding not be a good idea to help me

Thanks again, I already started to save money.

Regards

Hans

[NoLonger]

I only got a fatal error message. The program has to shut down and restart or words to that effect.

I definitely did not see OOM messages. I experienced the steering problems before the crash also during the approach with a B-29 after a long flight. The fatal error then occurred when the plane was already on the runway; so the crew was saved

Switching views seemed a reason as well to me. I actually did that quite often as Rome was our holiday destination and I like to orient myself on the lay-out of the actual airport versus the FTX one. (no complaints about the scenery here, they are excellent in my opinion, by the way)

I have a liquid cooled computer, that should take care of the overheating, should it not? I also have FSUIPC and can use the last saved flight moment, have a pause and continue. What I get from your replies is that the amount of accrued data in the video card memory is then less than when I would have continued flying.

I think I went to the limit of my set-up. As my own message already indicates. In a way you are all confirming this to me. It is an expensive conclusion though.

May I sum up your advice and ask you whether I concluded rightly?

- Any new development in FSX, like P3Dv3 or 64 bit will not be the solution for my current set-up.

- Both a state of the art GPU and CPU will help, but still no guarantee as then the 32bit limit will be the next hurdle to take, though much more remote.

- SSD to run FSX from. Which I don't have at the moment.

- Pause after 1 to 1,5 hours flying and a complete restart will help to overcome the problem with the current set-up.

What is meant by OP, by the way?

 

 

The advice you got and which you summed up mainly has to do with OOMs... however, you already said yourself you didn't have an OOM. So that isn't it. So a restart after 1,5 hours won't help and neither would 64 bit etc. An SSD won't help you either (that one won't even help with OOMs). Also take note that OOM has to do with VAS which has NOTHING to do with the memory of the GPU!

 

In short: you seem to have a problem with your system. Did you (re)install the OS lately? If not, you might consider starting new all over, so reinstall the OS by wiping your OS disk and do a complete fresh install (not a repair) and start from there. Don't install everything you own at once but do it step by step so you can easier find out what is causing you problems. Could well be a new start eliminates any problem you have.

 

OP either means Opening Post, so the first post of a topic, or Opening Poster, so the person who posted the opening post.

[spirit_66]

I didn't read every post in this thread so perhaps I ask what was already talked about. Did you have a look at the event viewer after the crash?

Spirit

[dominique]

 

I have a liquid cooled computer, that should take care of the overheating, should it not? Your cooling system is for the CPU and the graphic card or for the CPU only as it usually is ?

 

May I sum up your advice and ask you whether I concluded rightly?

- Any new development in FSX, like P3Dv3 or 64 bit will not be the solution for my current set-up. No, it won't. But P3D is really the way to go if you do a complete reinstall on a new machine. It is FSX + 3 years of new developments.

- Both a state of the art GPU and CPU will help, It may but the diagnosis of your fatal error is still unclear. The deviant behaviour of your joystick may also come from wornout pots, how old is it ? Is it a USB connected joystick ? but still no guarantee as then the 32bit limit will be the next hurdle to take, though much more remote.  the 32bits is something that I wouldn't care much about  There's absolutely no serious indication that a 64bits will be released in a defined future .  

- SSD to run FSX from. Which I don't have at the moment. A SSD is great but only good to speed up the initilal loading process. No other gain for simming. If you're short on money a good, much cheaper, HD will suffice.

- Pause after 1 to 1,5 hours flying and a complete restart will help to overcome the problem with the current set-up. Not sure if the issue is the 480 overheating for instance.  It will allow you to finish your flight in case of a crash.

What is meant by OP, by the way? Original Poster

Would crowd funding not be a good idea to help me  Nice try

Thanks again, I already started to save money.

Regards

Hans

[stufer]

Hi Hans

 

I'm with J van E on this. I think a reinstall would be the best bet. It may be laborious but it is certainly the cheaper option!

 

Also, if you're overclocking your CPU, try returning it to it's stock level when you reinstall and get everything set up at that level. Once you are sure it is all running well at the stock level, then slowly increase it bit by bit, testing it out every time you increase it. I overclock my system and when I haven't got it just right, I find it amplifies any errors I get and casues crashes and freezes when at stock level, it wouldn't have.

 

As for crowd-funding, yes that would probably help too! Good luck with that!

 

Hope you can get it sorted soon. Let us know how it goes.

 

Cheers

Stu.

[Bullfox]

Hans,

You are the OP.  OP I think means original poster.  The problem you had is very similar to the problems I used to have .  A long flight into a high scenery area and a system crash after landing.  I solved the problem by changing the way I fly in FSX.  I generally have three settings for the sliders. One for takeoff and climb out, one for cruise, and one for descent and landing, and in high scenery areas, one for approach and landing.  I save before changing the settings as the flight progresses.  Takeoff and climb settings can be a bit more to the right since its a new flight.  In cruise I frequently move the autogen and scenery complexity sliders all the way left, since I can't see that kind of detail much from high up anyway.  Also on long flights I am in autopilot and i wander away from the computer so not much messing with vews etc. gets done.  I generally save and exit before descent, take a short break, restart  the computer, reload FSX, and finish the flight.

 

Most guys would consider my hardware substandard.  I am running FSX in Windows 7 with 8 gigs of ram and a 240 gig SSD. The processor is a AMD quad core 3.1 overclocked to 3.5 ghz.  The card is an ADI 5850 overclocked to 800 mhz with one gig of memory.  I have an old Asus M4A77TD Delux motherboard.  I do have a case with 8 fans so overheating does not seem to be much of a problem.  Almost all my software is Orbx and A2A .  The system is remarkably stable.  After some tweaking its also very smooth with frame rates mostly between 20 and 30, but I don't fly into Seattle either.  My approach to setting it up has been to reduce the sliders to the point where I can see a decline in the display appearance then nudge back up just a bit rather than try to max out. .After blowing up an XP install with lots of add ons I decided when upgrading to Windows 7 to be very conservative with what I add on.  I am sure that lots of guys with lots of add ons do ok, but I read a lot about a lot of guys with lots of add ons that don't do ok.  

 

Nearly everybody on line has a better system than I do, and everybody who has problems does have a better system, so my only conclusion is that its not what you got, its how you use it.  I don't mean to be critical,  I'm just trying to make a helpful point based on my experience.

 

Steve Bullfox

[hanss]

Thanks again,

I'll use Dominiques reply to react.

I have a liquid cooled computer, that should take care of the overheating, should it not? Your cooling system is for the CPU and the graphic card or for the CPU only as it usually is ? No comments.

 

May I sum up your advice and ask you whether I concluded rightly?

- Any new development in FSX, like P3Dv3 or 64 bit will not be the solution for my current set-up. No, it won't. But P3D is really the way to go if you do a complete reinstall on a new machine. It is FSX + 3 years of new developments. So FSX-SE would not be the way to go and it would take too long to wait for the 64bit development they are talking about?

- Both a state of the art GPU and CPU will help, It may but the diagnosis of your fatal error is still unclear. The deviant behaviour of your joystick may also come from wornout pots, how old is it ? Is it a USB connected joystick ? It is USB connected, 5 years old but still seemed to be working fine. I will check again and also the FSUIPC data to operate the aircraft. Some time ago I found some discrepancies which could have returned or new ones come up in the program data. but still no guarantee as then the 32bit limit will be the next hurdle to take, though much more remote.  the 32bits is something that I wouldn't care much about  There's absolutely no serious indication that a 64bits will be released in a defined future .  See earlier point I mentioned.

- SSD to run FSX from. Which I don't have at the moment. A SSD is great but only good to speed up the initilal loading process. No other gain for simming. If you're short on money a good, much cheaper, HD will suffice. That is what I have.

- Pause after 1 to 1,5 hours flying and a complete restart will help to overcome the problem with the current set-up. Not sure if the issue is the 480 overheating for instance.  It will allow you to finish your flight in case of a crash. That is also in line with the comments of Steve. I will certainly follow that method. Would the tweakers which are available on the market and which differentiate between scenery heavy and light areas, help?

What is meant by OP, by the way? Original Poster Thanks I really didn't know. Excuse my ignorance.

Would crowd funding not be a good idea to help me  Nice try The crowd will probably be my wife granting money to be spent on my hobby

 

I will start trying this out and report back to you.

 

Regards

Hans

[Bullfox]

Hans,

When I was having similer problems I would sometime encounter problems like controls not working right and other odd behavior in sim.

I would suggest try the same flight. Before descent save and exit and restart the computer, then reload and finish the flight and see what happens. It it works that will keep you able to fly while you dig deeper on the problem. You may also find all that is necessary is to save and exit FSX, without the need to restart the machine. Its the simplest, quickest and cheapest way to begin to work the problem.

Steve Bullfox

[hanss]

Thanks Steve,

That is what I will do anyway before more drastic changes. See, I was boasting that I never had problems, till this one.

You will hear from me.

 

Regards

Hans

[dominique]

 

- Any new development in FSX, like P3Dv3 or 64 bit will not be the solution for my current set-up. No, it won't. But P3D is really the way to go if you do a complete reinstall on a new machine. It is FSX + 3 years of new developments. So FSX-SE would not be the way to go and it would take too long to wait for the 64bit development they are talking about? The truth is that a 64bits sim of the FS family  may not come before several years. I dont' have FSX-SE. It seems to be a well-improved FSX (with DX10 of course), by all simmers accounts, but it is, in my opinion, a dead end. Dovetail has thus announced that its next product would be a new sim.   I highly doubt to see a "FSX-SE v2" like we see now a P3D v3.

 

- Both a state of the art GPU and CPU will help, It may but the diagnosis of your fatal error is still unclear. The deviant behaviour of your joystick may also come from wornout pots, how old is it ? Is it a USB connected joystick ? It is USB connected, 5 years old but still seemed to be working fine. I will check again and also the FSUIPC data to operate the aircraft. Some time ago I found some discrepancies which could have returned or new ones come up in the program data.  When too many USB hardware are connected to my mobo, I've problems with my pedals (no connection at loading).

 

- Pause after 1 to 1,5 hours flying and a complete restart will help to overcome the problem with the current set-up. Not sure if the issue is the 480 overheating for instance.  It will allow you to finish your flight in case of a crash. That is also in line with the comments of Steve. I will certainly follow that method. Would the tweakers which are available on the market and which differentiate between scenery heavy and light areas, help? You mean tweaks of the snake_oil=1 kind  ?

 

 

[Rob Newman]

LOL! If it comes to peeing or landing, I pause the sim, go pee, then come back and finish up.

<Young guys are thinking: What are they talking about?>

Stew

That's hardly "as real as it gets", now, is it?

(Some of my best landings were the result of "self imposed physiological pressures" )

[Stewart Hobson]

That's hardly "as real as it gets", now, is it?

(Some of my best landings were the result of "self imposed physiological pressures" )

I know that feeling, too, Rob.  One does what he has to in order to get down on the runway in one piece.

[hanss]

All,

 

As promised, I have tried to continue flying from a saved situation. It works and gave no problems completing the flight. No steering problems either. However, I had to shut down FSX and restart, to get enough "space" to continue and complete the flight.

I must say, it gives you plenty of time to do more than some of you suggested, as FSX takes quite some time to start

 

Thanks very much for your input. Thinking aloud now; perhaps I should consider to change to P3D3 but then I probably need better hardware than I have now, or I should just wait till things further develop with respect to FSX software improvements. For the time being I will happily continue flying with what I have and save for the time the big decision has to be made.

 

Regards

 

Hans

[renault]

Hi Hans

 

Problems like this can be very difficult to solve without additional information. Rather than speculate about temperatures you might want to consider installing monitoring software to keep track of the cpu/gpu temps while FSX is running.

 

Some that I would suggest are either Real Temp or Cpu-Z for the CPU and MSI Afterburner for the GPU. In addition, the Cpu-z folks (http://www.cpuid.com/)   also have a tool called HWMonitor which monitors temperature on both CPU/GPU in one package.  All are freeware

 

MSI especially has some reasonable graphics  and this may give you a clue if indeed a wayward temperature is causing the problem. After you have sorted out the issue there is no need to keep them and you can uninstall. I'm not suggesting that I think that you have a temperature issue, but this approach would allow you to obtain additional information while the simulator is running that may either eliminate an area of investigation or point you towards an issue.

 

Best regards

Renault

[Culley44]

No you won't because all you are doing is increasing the envelope so that developers can push new limitations with things like 314 animated people on board a 777 boarding at the gate and watching movies in-flight and using the toilets at cruise altitude because.....As soon as you give a developer more resources guarantee they will use it up fully. Imagine what ORBX will do with scenery when they are able to push the envelope even further...

 

and then you get OOM's all over again because once again we are pushed to the limit, and the cycle continues. been going on since the early days of Atari in the 1970's so don't think for a second it is going to end...ever 

 

But I say bring it on because this is what keeps moving us forward year after year, isn't Flight Sim Fun 

 

you may dislike p3d v3 or it may not be for you, but i have done a straight 15 hour flight in the pmdg 777 putting my plane over payware scenery on purpose and still didn't have an oom and still had 700mb of vas left.fsx-se is almost completely cpu dependent.p3d v3 so far for me in alot of cases my cpu is only pushed about 50% while my 980ti is running between 70-90% usage.vas is still a problem because of the 32 bit and 4gb limit but lockheed has sure fixed it so the scenery gets dumped after you fly over it. also it was payware to payware airports.i was never able to do that with fsx or fsx-se.or p3d v2 for sure.

[VAL067]

As J said above just switch to P3D 2.5 or 3 preferably V3.0..Why build a shiny new rig and load a glitchy piece of software like FSX..its a heartbreaking process you spend hrs tweaking then fly.it breaks,reinstall,tweak and repeat.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

[hanss]

Hi all,

 

That sounds great, as if P3D v3 is the solution. Still I have to save money to buy the hardware. Bu the time I have a new set-up I'll see what improved flight simulators are then available. Anyway I have a goal to aim for.

Thanks for your thoughts on this.

Very much appreciated

 

Regards

 

Hans

[Bullfox]

At some point I want to go from AMD and FSX to Intel and P3D, skipping Steam all together. When I do the upgrade I will have at least a 500 gig ssd and the fastest system I can put together. However I also plan on keeping the vendors lists of hardware and add on software as short as possible.