YBBN - a mixed bag (both appreciation and genuine disappointment)

[ozzieblr]

I have been a long-time Orbx customer (many products), and have had both earlier versions of YBBN for P3D, and therefore qualified for the 50% discount for this updated version of the airport.  I appreciated the fact that this good discount was offered, and feel that there was a satisfactory level of value for money, now having the new runway, taxiways and additional aprons represented at this very important Aussie airport.

 

There are, however, some howevers.

 

1. I would have felt severely ripped off had I had to pay full price for the tiny advancement in quality that this product provides other than the features mentioned above.

 

2. The airport buildings do not appear to represent a complete make-over, and one glaring example of that is the fact that the Qantas signage at the domestic terminal building is that of the previous logo/font combination which is now years out of date.  This is our major domestic and international airline, gentlemen, and the Qantas domestic terminal probably by far the most-used part of the airport - it should have been brought up to date.  It took me less that an hour of checking to find the correct files, and graphics work in photoshop to replace those signs with the current logo (see aerial shot below) ... surely your professionals should have done that in the first place and done it to a truly professional standard. 

 

3. There are quite a few other things that other users have mentioned as well in various forums and facebook groups - eg better terminal detailing inside and out. 

 

I trust that rather than excusing the product (as one team member has done already), Orbx will take a good honest look at the product and its competition (Impulse's recent YPAD for example), and do something about upgrading YBBN properly?

 

I hope I can look forward to a not-too-distant update which will see this airport become something Orbx can honestly be proud to put its name to.

 

 

[burge]

Well Said my good man

[ozzieblr]

What is even more worrying now, though, is the fact that one of the Orbx team members has locked an earlier thread on this forum so no further unflattering comments can be added.  As I said above, for the 50% price I paid, I am satisfied with the additional runway, taxiways and apron areas - but this airport does not represent good value at full price.  To lock a thread expressing that same view is commercial censorship and such behaviour has no place in the flightsim world.

 

When a developer does this because they do not like what they are reading, how can it possibly serve to build confidence in the publisher or its content???????

 

I would urge any user who has already expressed their frustration about YBBN in that locked thread, and any other user who has frustrations (ILS, jetways, lack of detail, out of date details, etc.) to come to this thread and re-post their concerns, or express any other experience/frustrations with the product here.  I would also urge any dissatisfied YBBN customer to encourage others to come and express themselves here too.  They will be forced to listen if there is a deluge of consumer comment.

 

If Orbx is honest they would certainly have to admit that their YBBN product falls way short of the standard set by the recently-released YPAD airport from Impulse.  And if they are genuine in a desire to provide quality products for MSFS users rather than rush an inferior product to market for the sake of $, they will listen, respond in a mature and responsible way, and where necessary, take it on the chin as they should.

 

And if Orbx locks this thread too, let's take to all the MSFS forums on Facebook and elsewhere and tell the whole flightsim world how Orbx handles consumer dissatisfaction.

[Davo79]

Thank god for the discounted price as I just laughed when I attempted to get the aerobridge to connect to my Jetstar A320 on the domestic stand at YBBN.

Out it comes, slowly. Stops and attempts to extend but doesn’t even wrap around the aircraft properly, misaligned aerobridge is an understatement here 

Poor effort Orbx. Lack of testing on your behalf. Rushed through without proper testing to pick this up.  

Ive said for ages now, you have shifted your loyalties and gone overseas for the $$$.
Sorry Australia is only considered a small fish in a big pond when it comes to the flight simulation market.  
This scenery was turned over to your designers in Havant. Pretty sure that’s over in the UK. Why there?? Not here where your grass roots once laid. 
As always, having to go overseas to get things made instead of investing locally with designers here in Australia. Your base is still in Essendon isn’t it??

 

Impulse Simulations, NZA Simulations, Shunts Sceneries and AUscene are all releasing top quality Australian airports now, which makes me think these guys are the future for sceneries here in Australia. 

Orbx, stop putting your tail between your legs, then run away when valid criticism is pointed at you from your loyal customer base. You don’t simply close a post because you don’t like what has been posted. That’s censorship. 
Orbx, please listen to your customer base and adapt to the changing market.  
Your better than that. 
That is all. 
 

 

Edited July 18, 2021 by Davo79

[mrd0ct0r]

It really is the small things that make this scenery fall apart for me. Ground markings, jetways and things that are simply still out of date. A real shame. Had I paid full price for this it would be hurting a lot more.

 

If Orbx decide to bring YMML to MFS I hope to see substantial improvements because this rendition of YBBN simply leaves more to be desired and a lot left on the table when compared to the quality of other airports.

[AussieEd]

Well said.

 

Many issues, for NRP, no SIDs available for NPR, I have to pay Navigraph to update the nav data. 

 

Not all aerobridges are able to line up with aircraft properly. 

 

I can even see trees around NPR's new taxiways. Details of buildings are not acceptable. Many out of date stuff. 

 

50% of full price is well worth the NPR but not all of them. 

[AMD72]

13 hours ago, ozzieblr said:

 

 

 

 Hi Ozzieblr

 

I agree with your sentiments, but just want to let you know that you have some old freeware scenery still active in your community folder (see tower). I know this because I did the same thing when I first loaded up the sim after installing YBBN. This won't correct the issues you have mentioned though.

[hjmx]

Alone the fact that Orbx closed the above mentioned critical thread without any comment was reason enough to remove YBBN from my basket again. Buying Orbx products was a no-brainer for me for many many years. Orbx where are you going?

[himmelhorse]

I am more than vaguely interested in  this thread.

I had the first YBBN for P3D which was VERY disappointing. I then invested in Orbx AU2 and YBBN v2 for P3D and I was happy with AU2 with reservations and fairly disappointed with YBBNv2 for P3D

When this was announced for MSFS I was going to be a first day buyer. Luckily, for me, I guess, I was firmly held up in hospital and only released into the custody of my internet today.  

To say that I am disappointed with the comments about the latest release is an understatement and I have, and will, hold off until there is a vast improvement in the ratings generated here.  I simply want to avoid a third "bad buy" with this for MSFS.

Thank you all guys for your comments.

Tony

[Paul Ozzman]

Definitely the first Orbx that I regret buying.Expected a lot more from them. Hopefully we will get some kind of update.

Edited July 19, 2021 by Paul Ozzman

[EasternT3]

6 hours ago, AussieEd said:

Many issues, for NRP, no SIDs available for NPR, I have to pay Navigraph to update the nav data. 

 

I personally have never seen a add-on airport come with up to date nav data, so I don't see this being Orbx's fault, that be said follow the steps in the topic below, this is geared for Navigraph users but I hope it will work for non-navigraph users as well,  just move Orbx's YBBN between the “fs-base” line and the “fs-base-nav” line in your content.xml file. Hopefully this works as well for people not using navigraph

 

 

[shinkicker444]

That's one of the things that makes me so angry about this is the fact I did pay full price, the equivalent of what Sydney cost. The fact that "team members" are dismissing criticism and locking threads (which is now open again, admittedly) makes me want to reconsider doing business with Orbx.

 

I'd be fine with not having an interior, it'd be nice but it isn't a complete deal breaker. Even Sydney only has a small interior section rather than a fully modelled one like like... uh, Krakow. But the textures being so bad on the buildings and the ground and other external 3D modelling to make things not look like flat boxes along with the jetways not connecting and being placed too high all need to be fixed to make this remotely worth the full price.

Edited July 19, 2021 by shinkicker444

[burge]

Im going to wait for now i jumped on YBBN as soon as i seen it, now i  am paying for it jetways broken roads not even going there computer crash twice

never has my up to date computer did that

[rockliffe]

Any business, in any field, should welcome positive criticism, as it gives the business an opportunity to correct the issue and to turn the negative into a positive experience. This is straight out of the ABC book of good business practices 

[John Dow]

7 hours ago, rockliffe said:

Any business, in any field, should welcome positive criticism, as it gives the business an opportunity to correct the issue and to turn the negative into a positive experience. This is straight out of the ABC book of good business practices 

I agree entirely. However if you look at the original comments it could be argued that many of the comments were hardly positive criticism. Given our species' penchant for herd behaviour and jumping on bandwagons, i suspect the temporary closure of the thread was put in place as a circuit breaker. 

 

That said, all constructive criticism and reported issues are being compiled and worked on. 

[XCLTM3]

On 7/27/2021 at 11:04 AM, John Dow said:

I agree entirely. However if you look at the original comments it could be argued that many of the comments were hardly positive criticism. Given our species' penchant for herd behaviour and jumping on bandwagons, i suspect the temporary closure of the thread was put in place as a circuit breaker. 

 

That said, all constructive criticism and reported issues are being compiled and worked on. 

 

@John Dow

 

not sure if what you stated ie: "many of the comments were hardly positive criticism"  may have been including my criticism of YBBN, if so I'd really like to have it highlighted for me to peruse.

 

Additionally, it's pleasing to see that "reported issues are being compiled and worked on", but unless I'm mistaken, I haven't seen any announcement regarding YBBN issues being addressed anywhere here on the forum other than your statement buried in this thread. And if I have searched thoroughly and indeed there is no announcement - can I request that Orbx place a stand-alone Statement/Topic for all to see (and locate in easier terms)? Nice to also have specifics regarding what actual items are being worked on.

 

Many thanks.

[WR269]

I have to echo the sentiments here....a few of the details are hard to believe they were missed....

 

Brisbane does NOT have nor has it EVER had any taxiway edge lights.....there are no Australian airports with taxiway edge lights, only centre lights (green) yet in Orbx's payware rendition you have a sea of blue edge lights....

 

The two high speed exits decommissioned are painted GREEN in real life to make sure no aircraft enters (as it has nearly happened several times)...this is also not replicated...

 

The size and classification of gates/ramp is totally wrong...I could go on and on....if they need someone with actual data (and who actually works at the airport) let me know, but this falls short of expectations.

[XCLTM3]

On 7/27/2021 at 11:04 AM, John Dow said:

I agree entirely. However if you look at the original comments it could be argued that many of the comments were hardly positive criticism. Given our species' penchant for herd behaviour and jumping on bandwagons, i suspect the temporary closure of the thread was put in place as a circuit breaker. 

 

That said, all constructive criticism and reported issues are being compiled and worked on. 

 

@John Dow

@Anna Cicognani

 

"Given our species' penchant for herd behaviour and jumping on bandwagons" - If I'm to understand that statement - you perceive that a group of customers who visit the forum over a span of time and communicate their disappointment with a newly released product and even provide specifics regarding the various issues - and this is regarded as "herd behaviour and jumping on bandwagons"? 

 

That's quite a thing to say out aloud to your customer base. Is that what the entire team all the way to the leadership at Orbx believes? If a group of customers raise valid concerns over a specific Orbx product over a period of any given time frame, that this is a form of mob mentality?

 

Perhaps I might assist here - the reality is, that a newly released product purchased by a group of customers all of whom likely purchased the product within hours or days of each other - who then decide they're disappointed with the product and will take time out of their day to communicate this in the proper allocated forum (which is the appropriate protocol), is not a herd collective, nor is it jumping on bandwagons. 

 

I would also like to review this statement - "i suspect the temporary closure of the thread was put in place as a circuit breaker". 

If I may ask, at what point in time did any of the discussions clearly breach forum rules (and which specific rules) to constitute closure of any kind, let alone a "temporary" one?

Where was the evidence pointing to "customer hysteria" that led to the circuit breaker being tripped? 

Might I add, the topic was closed without warning or a message from an Orbx staff member explaining why the topic was being closed - albeit temporarily.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Nick Cooper]

Hello,

as I posted in this topic

and this reply:

all customer comments are being noted and will be acted on.

 

I have created an internal topic which includes links to all the reported issues and this

topic and the one above are both linked in it.

[Nick Cooper]

3 hours ago, WR269 said:

II could go on and on....if they need someone with actual data (and who actually works at the airport) let me know, but this falls short of expectations.

 

If you have a longer list, please share it in this topic.

I would expect that it would be of benefit to the developer, yourself and your fellow customers.

[Dr Smith]

8 hours ago, WR269 said:

I have to echo the sentiments here....a few of the details are hard to believe they were missed....

 

Brisbane does NOT have nor has it EVER had any taxiway edge lights.....there are no Australian airports with taxiway edge lights, only centre lights (green) yet in Orbx's payware rendition you have a sea of blue edge lights....

 

The two high speed exits decommissioned are painted GREEN in real life to make sure no aircraft enters (as it has nearly happened several times)...this is also not replicated...

 

The size and classification of gates/ramp is totally wrong...I could go on and on....if they need someone with actual data (and who actually works at the airport) let me know, but this falls short of expectations.

Are you referring to international Australian airports only or all Australian airports?  If all, I can tell you YMMB definitely has blue taxiway edge lighting.

[ozzieblr]

20 hours ago, Nick Cooper said:

Hello,

as I posted in this topic

and this reply:

all customer comments are being noted and will be acted on.

 

I have created an internal topic which includes links to all the reported issues and this

topic and the one above are both linked in it.

 

Hi Nick

 

As one of the early participants in this discussion, I am glad to come back now and find an administrator who is listening, noting concerns, and reporting those concerns back to the developer.  That is what should have happened with the very first post, rather than locking the thread.  That is the kind of response that could have short-circuited a lot of the negative press that Orbx has since endured.  It's the kind of response that builds consumer confidence and loyalty.

 

A few salient points for Orbx to consider: 

 

1. Now that Orbx is listening, and the consumer base is beginning to feel as if it might have been heard, is it possible to give us the complete list of things that the developer is going to rectify so that if something has been missed or has not yet been brought to your attention it can be (now) so that the next iteration of YBBN is a refreshingly pleasing product to all users. 

2. It might also be confidence-boosting to know that the planned rectification of those issues is being attended to in a matter of days/weeks rather than months/years.  (I brought to Orbx attention a couple of years ago that the new runway was almost completed and requested that Orbx update YBBN for FSX/P3D to reflect that, and nothing was done about it until now - more than a year since that runway opened.)  

3. Further, it would be reassuring to those of us who have already parted with our cash to know that the update will be offered to us free of charge.

 

I await your response.

 

[Nick Cooper]

Hello,

1. the developer has access to the relevant topics which I have collated into a single internal topic.

2. I have read internally that the reported problems are being addressed.

3. so far, Orbx have never charged for a service pack and I see no reason to suppose that they will start doing so now.  

[ozzieblr]

1 hour ago, Nick Cooper said:

Hello,

1. the developer has access to the relevant topics which I have collated into a single internal topic.

2. I have read internally that the reported problems are being addressed.

3. so far, Orbx have never charged for a service pack and I see no reason to suppose that they will start doing so now.  

 

1. My request was that the list be published here so that no concerns are missed in the coming update.

2. I was hoping that you and the developer could indicate the kind of time-frame we are looking at for any update to YBBN - rapid-response timing has not been a strong point in Orbx's recent history.

3. If it is a free service pack that is being prepared, that is great, thank you!

 

[EasternT3]

2 hours ago, ozzieblr said:

 (I brought to Orbx attention a couple of years ago that the new runway was almost completed and requested that Orbx update YBBN for FSX/P3D to reflect that, and nothing was done about it until now - more than a year since that runway opened.)

 

I get this point, but I don't think it made any sense updating a old V1 product with the new runway, it probably wasn't that easy to do, and waiting till they released a v2 made sense. 

 

Hopefully an update will be sooner rather than later, 

Edited July 30, 2021 by EasternT3