DLSS in SU10

[Jon Clarke]

I am unsure about the use of DLSS when SU10 is released and would like some input from those who have used it in the SU10 beta.

I have a 4K monitor and i the MSFS Resolution setting I am at 3840x2160

I understand that the Render Scale setting becomes blanked out if you choose a DLSS setting.

What I am asking is that in order to use DLSS do I keep my MSFS Resolution option at 3840x2160 or do I need to change it down to say 2560x1600 or leave as is.

If I leave as is, then what if anything will DLSS do for me?

[BradB]

I have a GSync desktop monitor that I run in 2560x 1600  .  I used the beta thru Steam with DX12 and DLSS and

had no issues . The DLSS will yield better FPS than TAA . Here is a video that shows it well : 

 

 

Cheers

John

[paulb]

1 hour ago, BradB said:

I have a GSync desktop monitor that I run in 2560x 1600  .  I used the beta thru Steam with DX12 and DLSS and

had no issues . The DLSS will yield better FPS than TAA . Here is a video that shows it well : 

 

 

Cheers

John

 

A good video John. I can see the big difference in frame rate but TAA does look sharper (better) in the video IMO. I guess that I will just have to try the different options when SU10 is released .

[renault]

6 hours ago, Jon Clarke said:

I am unsure about the use of DLSS when SU10 is released and would like some input from those who have used it in the SU10 beta.

I have a 4K monitor and i the MSFS Resolution setting I am at 3840x2160

I understand that the Render Scale setting becomes blanked out if you choose a DLSS setting.

What I am asking is that in order to use DLSS do I keep my MSFS Resolution option at 3840x2160 or do I need to change it down to say 2560x1600 or leave as is.

If I leave as is, then what if anything will DLSS do for me?

Hi Jon

 

Assuming that the final release uses the same code as the Beta:

 

1) You don't change any resolution settings just leave it at your native monitor resolution

2) In the Antialiasing setting you can select TAA and the other standard settings as before OR 

     you can select DLSS -Quality, DLSS - Balanced, DLSS -Performance, or DLSS - High Performance

3) There is also a new slider called AMD FIDELITY FX Sharpening which allows adjustment

4) Both these setting sliders can be adjusted in real time

 

 

In the beta it was very easy and worked extremely well to allow adjustment to your particular system

Hope this helps 

Pete

 

 

Edited September 21, 2022 by renault

[paulb]

1 hour ago, renault said:

Hi Jon

 

Assuming that the final release uses the same code as the Beta:

 

1) You don't change any resolution settings just leave it at your native monitor resolution

2) In the Antialiasing setting you can select TAA and the other standard settings as before OR 

     you can select DLSS -Quality, DLSS - Balanced, DLSS -Performance, or DLSS - High Performance

3) There is also a new slider called AMD FIDELITY FX Sharpening which allows adjustment

4) Both these setting sliders can be adjusted in real time

 

 

In the beta it was very easy and worked extremely well to allow adjustment to your particular system

Hope this helps 

Pete

 

 

 

Interesting Pete. What do you think provides the best quality - TAA or DLSS Quality or......?

Thanks 

[renault]

1 hour ago, paulb said:

 

Interesting Pete. What do you think provides the best quality - TAA or DLSS Quality or......?

Thanks 

For me, with the spoiler alert that I am a nerd about colour fidelity, I only use DLSS Quality. I didn't care for the other settings

Secondly at 1440p locked at 30 fps with vsync in MS2020,  I don't have any issues with either GPU usage or CPU usage with

everything on Ultra.

 

So DLSS - Quality does give me a nice boost  and visually I like the result very much.  I have done a lot of testing between TAA and DLSS-Quality

and at the resolution I use I can't see any difference.

 

Here is an example I made a few days ago with SU10 Beta

 

Both are at 2560x1440p which is my monitor native resolution.

Native Resolution - TAA 100% Scaling

# of Unique colours - 336,175

 

 

This is DLSS - Quality Setting

# of Unique Colours = 323,602

 

 

There is a small difference in the number of unique colours, but aside from that , I struggle to see any 

difference in the images but perhaps you can. 

 

It might be more noticeable at 4K, though  eg. you have a 4K monitor and you are using DLSS with that native resolution.

So my comment and the above images, may be unique to my particular situation.

 

I do however see a difference as one uses lower DLSS settings.  The reason for this is that the downscaled image which is where

the performance improvement comes from has less colour information than the original native image.  As a result when you

upscale it back to native resolution the DLSS AI algorithm doesn't appear to have sufficient information  to realistically add the 

colour variation back in.  As a result I found that the color fidelity deteriorated and the contrast increased , both of which I didn't

care for.  

 

However, everyone is different and the visual change vs the performance improvement is a personal decision.

 

If you turn on the FPS indicator in development mode, you can see the actual downscaled image size that DLSS is using

in the data summary just below the fps value.  Post is you actual monitor resolution and Render is the downscaled resolution

that the DLSS algorithm is using for the particular DLSS setting you have chosen.

 

Hope this helps

Pete 

 

 

Edited September 21, 2022 by renault

[paulb]

2 hours ago, renault said:

For me, with the spoiler alert that I am a nerd about colour fidelity, I only use DLSS Quality. I didn't care for the other settings

Secondly at 1440p locked at 30 fps with vsync in MS2020,  I don't have any issues with either GPU usage or CPU usage with

everything on Ultra.

 

So DLSS - Quality does give me a nice boost  and visually I like the result very much.  I have done a lot of testing between TAA and DLSS-Quality

and at the resolution I use I can't see any difference.

 

Here is an example I made a few days ago with SU10 Beta

 

Both are at 2560x1440p which is my monitor native resolution.

Native Resolution - TAA 100% Scaling

# of Unique colours - 336,175

 

 

This is DLSS - Quality Setting

# of Unique Colours = 323,602

 

 

There is a small difference in the number of unique colours, but aside from that , I struggle to see any 

difference in the images but perhaps you can. 

 

It might be more noticeable at 4K, though  eg. you have a 4K monitor and you are using DLSS with that native resolution.

So my comment and the above images, may be unique to my particular situation.

 

I do however see a difference as one uses lower DLSS settings.  The reason for this is that the downscaled image which is where

the performance improvement comes from has less colour information than the original native image.  As a result when you

upscale it back to native resolution the DLSS AI algorithm doesn't appear to have sufficient information  to realistically add the 

colour variation back in.  As a result I found that the color fidelity deteriorated and the contrast increased , both of which I didn't

care for.  

 

However, everyone is different and the visual change vs the performance improvement is a personal decision.

 

If you turn on the FPS indicator in development mode, you can see the actual downscaled image size that DLSS is using

in the data summary just below the fps value.  Post is you actual monitor resolution and Render is the downscaled resolution

that the DLSS algorithm is using for the particular DLSS setting you have chosen.

 

Hope this helps

Pete 

 

 

 

Many thanks Pete.

That is very helpful. Certainly looking at your two shots, I cannot see any real difference.

I have just now installed SU10, so tomorrow I will probably try the different settings - TAA and DLSS Quality.

I too use ultra settings and have a nice fluid movement on screen.

Overall, I am quite happy with my sim so I won't bother with the other DLSS settings.

Thanks again

Paul

 

[Jack Sawyer]

Update was fast and flawless.  In DLSS and DX12 it’s never been more fluid.  Very pleased with the update and no broken planes either.

[Jon Clarke]

Many thanks to those that responded to my post.

All good info and I am enjoying very smooth flying at 3840x2160 4K with DLSS at Quality and all settings at Ultra.

Before I tried DLSS I left all my settings as before the update and noticed there was an improvement in smoothness and FPS with SU10 in comparison to SU9

[paulb]

7 hours ago, Jack Sawyer said:

Update was fast and flawless.  In DLSS and DX12 it’s never been more fluid.  Very pleased with the update and no broken planes either.

 

Same here with the update Jack. Although I needed to go to content manager after the update to install updates to the world updates.

[ravenn22]

I actually rolled back DLSS when testing settings in VR last night - was getting worse perf than TAA. I heard incoming nVidia drivers might help, and wasn't running DX12  ( forgot to test it )  will check it again later this week

[renault]

1 hour ago, ravenn22 said:

I actually rolled back DLSS when testing settings in VR last night - was getting worse perf than TAA. I heard incoming nVidia drivers might help, and wasn't running DX12  ( forgot to test it )  will check it again later this week

Hi 

 

Until Asobo actually turns the DX12 memory manager in MS2020 back on (it was disabled in the SU10 beta because of an identified 

Nvidia driver issue), a updated game ready driver is a necessary , but not complete solution. 

 

Pure speculation on my part , but I would  expect that Asobo would issue the revised code to the Beta testing group first to confirm

that all is well and then release it.

 

I was part of the SU10 beta testing group and I have remained in the test as the version we are using is identical to the release version.

Last night I did a DDU uninstall of the game ready 516.49 driver and installed the newest studio driver.  I repeated my test runs at Brisbane

that I was using during the Beta to monitor performance as Orbx Brisbane a/p is a very good loading exercise.

 

I saw no change in either DX11 or DX12 performance (this was flat panel and not VR).  I then DDU uninstalled the studio driver

and reinstalled the game ready 516.49 driver and retested.

 

There was no change.  I use the task manager, the MS2020 FPS monitor and CPU-Z to  and monitor performance 

 

Other people may have different opinions based upon their setup but unless Asobo has actually added something to the

release version which invalidates the following, I believe that the comment that a sim update from Asobo is required to work

with the updated Nvidia driver is correct.

 

From 

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/beta-testers-new-information-on-joining-leaving-the-beta/543728

 

and under FAQ's in answer to the question concerning any differences between the beat and the release version  ...

"No, the beta group has already received the version that will be released to the public (1.27.21.0)."

 

Cheers

Pete

Edited September 22, 2022 by renault

[ravenn22]

fair enough - I tuned it where it's running fine in both 4k 2D and VR...  I'm fine to wait for DX12 and later drivers
It still annoys me that they change your graphic settings, so you jump in to check the game and are like "wow - way smoother!!"  then realize clouds got set to LOW and AA is way down....  then you go set everything back and it's like "i guess it's better?"    

[renault]

1 hour ago, ravenn22 said:

fair enough - I tuned it where it's running fine in both 4k 2D and VR...  I'm fine to wait for DX12 and later drivers
It still annoys me that they change your graphic settings, so you jump in to check the game and are like "wow - way smoother!!"  then realize clouds got set to LOW and AA is way down....  then you go set everything back and it's like "i guess it's better?"    

Hi again

I can certainly appreciate how frustrating that must be.

Oddly enough I have never had it happen to me.

 

Just lucky I guess . On the other hand at times perhaps the most accurate 

comment might be "It's not a question of if it will happen to you, its only a question of when it will happen". 

Cheers

Pete

[ravenn22]

It's NBD...  just some SIM updates will change some of my settings, but most stay the same - I just didn't check first to see before flying. easy fix when you notice it

[renault]

1 hour ago, ravenn22 said:

fair enough - I tuned it where it's running fine in both 4k 2D and VR...  I'm fine to wait for DX12 and later drivers
It still annoys me that they change your graphic settings, so you jump in to check the game and are like "wow - way smoother!!"  then realize clouds got set to LOW and AA is way down....  then you go set everything back and it's like "i guess it's better?"    

Hi again

 

The situation is more intriguing

 

Please refer to page 5 in this posting on Avsim

Matt N of Working Title is indicating that it is the driver itself which will turn memory optimization on

i.e. it is included in the release version of  MS2020 SU10 and is activated by the correct driver.

 

https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/624263-su-10-is-out/page/5/?tab=comments#comment-4844659

 

Strangely as I indicated , I saw no change whatsoever.

The biggest issue I have found with MS2020 is that there is no such thing as a standard operating

environment i.e. everyone's PC is different in some way

 

Hence what works great for some , fails miserably for others.

 

For me it didn't work so I will just wait for the game ready driver and give it a whirl again.

 

Thanks for bring up the comment.  I never would have gone through the very long thread on SU10 at Avsim , most of 

which wasn't terribly relevant for answering technical issues.  But there are some buried nuggets that are helpful and your 

comment prompted me to have another look.

 

Hopefully MS will update their official website with that nugget 

 

Cheers

Pete

 

 

 

[Nick Cooper]

Hello,

my own experience is that the best choice, for me, is Direct X 11 and my 2K screen using DSR to emulate 4k.

Direct X 12 appears to be exactly the same to look at as Direct X 11 is, except that all 12GB of the VRAM is immediately filled to the brim.
DLSS just makes everything look less sharp with no upside, the frame rate and general performance do not change.

The highly intrusive in-game frame rate counter consistently tells me that the game is CPU limited and my very expensive new graphics card

is just leaning on its fence, idling along with what dribs and drabs the CPU can feed it.

 

Meanwhile, the simulator looks great and performs perfectly adequately.

[renault]

5 hours ago, Nick Cooper said:

Hello,

my own experience is that the best choice, for me, is Direct X 11 and my 2K screen using DSR to emulate 4k.

Direct X 12 appears to be exactly the same to look at as Direct X 11 is, except that all 12GB of the VRAM is immediately filled to the brim.
DLSS just makes everything look less sharp with no upside, the frame rate and general performance do not change.

The highly intrusive in-game frame rate counter consistently tells me that the game is CPU limited and my very expensive new graphics card

is just leaning on its fence, idling along with what dribs and drabs the CPU can feed it.

 

Meanwhile, the simulator looks great and performs perfectly adequately.

 

This is a really excellent point Nick.

 

There are now a wide range of options available that will allow a user to select the best settings combination that works best for their

particular situation.

 

All of this is just part of the toolbox.  There is no right or wrong.

 

I'm just pleased now that we have this type of choice available. as with a bit of experimentation

it is possible to come up with settings that work best for your own requirements

 

Cheers

Pete

[Ryanm]

Forgot about Update #10 specifically. I don't get much time to "fly" MSFS and it's painful that just about every time I load it up, it needs a mandatory update. There goes my "Flying" time for today...

I just checked my settings, and it seems DLSS was selected for me. I certainly didn't as it's always been set to TAA. Still using DX11.

I have to say, I found DLSS blurry and much of a let down. I've gone back to TAA for the time being. Hate spending time changing settings, I just want to fly!!