RESOLVED Edinburgh Airport

[Penzoil3]

 Should the airport look like this?  And my harbor area seems flooded. I've tried switching to default, and then back to Europe in FTX Central, no change.

 Thanks

 Sue

 

 

 

 

 

[Penzoil3]

Well, RTFM!  A mesh adjustment fixed the flooding. The airport still looks odd.

 Sue

[John Venema]

That is how the airport is meant to look like Sue, not sure what you think is odd about it. Marking this 'resolved'.

[Penzoil3]

Equipment in the grass, parking lots with no roads to them, little blobs for cars. . Odd shaped chunks of scenerery like the ones in the center of the top picture. It looks like Microsnot peeking through, LOL, not an FTX airport.

 Sorry...

[John Venema]

I don't mean to be rude Sue, but please compare the FTX upgraded version to the default one and let me know if we've improved it at all. I think expectations have been raised too high after our free EGFF payware-quality airport bundled with WLS.

[kaboki]

Think I have to go out and buy UK2000 Extreme Edinburg, because this airport doesnt fit well with the gourgeous photoreal Edinburg, the contrast gets to big(for me). I know we can't excpect payware quality airports with the regions and fully accept that, that's what airport addons are for

Hope you'll consider doing Edinburg Int in the future because UK2000 Extreme isn't up to your standards, but it will do while I wait.

[GlennH]

the uk2000 airports would be great as far as I am concerned except for one big issue.......the photo texture base that uk2000 use is so different in colour to the surrounding FTX textures that it totally ruins the immersion. is there any way around this does anyone know?

[Griphos]

Well, if that's correct scenery, then I won't be getting Scotland. And I don't have Wales, so my expectations haven't been effected by that. They are set by all the non-payware airports in the NA and AU scenery, which look much more natural and realistic. Not payware quality, of course, but also no random, oddly shaped, poor renditions of buildings and parking lots. I'd say what I see above is certainly no improvement over default.

One of the values of FTX regions is the way even non-payware airports are much better at representing believable terrain patterns where it matters--where one is closest to the scenery. The shots of the countryside look great, as do the shots of airports in the islands, where it appears that care was taken to blend the airports into the surrounding scenery in a believable way. So it is surprising to see these shots of a prominent airport and have then called correct.

[FleetingThought]

Really, the whole area is quite beautiful.

I found the flat texture for the massive parking lots a tiny bit jarring, after the brilliant job with same in PNW. But it's really just a nit, for me at least.

Oh and I should add, though, if those parking lot textures are helping give me fantastic frame rates in very dense areas.... Don't change a thing! There are always compromises to be made.

[John Venema]

Really it does not bother us if you don't buy SCO because Edinburgh is not what you were expecting. Clearly the concept of what our regions do first and foremost seems to be lost on some people. It's a terrain addon, not an airport one.

We cop critique on the chin pretty well around here but to give us grief for a whole region because a particular airport is not up to a perceived standard is shortsighted at best.

[Griphos]

I'm not trying to argue or give you "grief."  Just feedback.  And actually, it's the terrain I'm talking about, not the airport taxiways or runways or buildings.  It's the terrain in the middle of the first picture, with odd shaped blocks of what I assume are supposed to be parking lots and some small urban area (Ingliston?).  

 

I don't think the concept of "region" scenery is lost on me.  I have almost all of your scenery.  I've flown hundreds of hours over it.  I have a pretty good sense of what it does. What I've always valued about your scenery is the believable terrain rather than the odd shaped vaguely representational chunks that you get in default.  Particularly around airports.  Particularly around the main airports in a region.  It's the believable terrain, whether or not it actually is what is there that allows me to enjoy virtual flight, and what keeps me flying in FSX (before your scenery came along, I had quit FSX because of the lack of believable terrain).  I'm not someone who wants photorealism.  I'm not expecting that whatever is there in life should be in the scenery.  I'm someone who values believable scenery, something that looks real, whether it is representing something there or not.  That sort of thing, the sort of thing I've grown accustomed to from your AU and NA scenery regions (I have all of them), is why I've bought so many of your products.  And that's what is missing in the pictures above.  

 

Like I've said, some of the other pictures of the island airports seem to have had more attention spent on them in that regard.  And you don't start in the air over the heather.  You take off from airports, and land at them, and are closest to the terrain scenery at them.  That's the reason the scenery matters around the airports so much, and why I've always appreciated the attention to them paid in the AU and NA regions.  

[John Venema]

Then enjoy the REGION for what it is and not give us grief over a few shortcomings about Edinburgh Airport, for #%*^+ sake. I am sick to my back teeth about people having a go about the nth detail at a certain airport when it's the region they are purchasing. Care to cast your mind back to the AU series of regions where every airport was FSX default without any attention to upgrades?

[rockliffe]

Hey JV, I don't think it's anyone's intention to give you grief, just bringing to the table some opinions. Like many others, I have been a staunch supporter of all your sceneries, but you know, I think it has to be accepted that if someone invests heavily in a company's products that it's perfectly reasonable for them to have an opinion if they feel unhappy with something, yeah?

I think the problem is that we all expect too much from you guys, after all, you do a great job. But, I too was surprised at taking off from Edinburgh to find such a default style of autogen so close to the airport. I mean would it not be acceptable to expect a little extra attention to placement of textures around airports. That's all. I have noticed similar autogen/scenery placement in England too. Maybe it's a big deal from a work point of view, in which case then OK. I'm not a scenery developer, so perhaps it's not possible within the constraints of your development budget. I'm not making a big deal out of things, just wanted to share some thoughts

[FleetingThought]

This is the thing I realized shortly after getting PNW: there's all of PNW to explore! Ditto here, England, Wales. the transitions from fields, to hills, to mountains, is wonderful; you really feel like it's a fully cohesive experience. NO issue crossing over the border from England to Scotland. Seamless!

And the thing I like and continue to discover with all of ORBX's regions is that they are quite distinct.

The biggest problem I had with FSX default is that the whole world looked generic. Not any more! And there's YEARS of exploration in each region to be had, quite seriously.

So I'd just cheerfully recommend getting out of the city and enjoying all the marvelous countryside, with its villages, fields, gorgeous ORBX trees, rolling hills and very compellingly textured mountains.

I love all the NA regions but I really do think the devs for the British Isles have outdone even the mountains in the Pacific Northwest; the results have the subtlety appropriate to a milder but still majestic geography.

So a coupla parking lot textures.... Who cares. Especially since I can turn up Autogen and get a lot of detail that way that really gives extensive flavor to the Edinburgh area.

I hate shopping malls anyways; in a few short years all those lots will be gone, and returned to better use.

[fltsimguy]

Agreed "Fleeting Thought" with most of your comments.  It's all good...but I have to say Edinburgh is the major hub and centre of the universe for Scotland.  I find given all the excellent work in this region the parking lots are "tacky".  However I see two options, one - I can fix this myself or two - seek out a replacement airport for which there is an excellent one available.

[Ripcord]

You know first thing I did was fry a Glasgow-Edinburgh hop just as soon as I installed this thing, and I didn't notice anything out of place at either airport.  OK I didn't taxi all the way to the gate at E-burg upon arrival, I was ready to move on to the next flight, but I can say that I didn't notice anything obvious wrong, as did the originater of this thread.  So maybe this should have been a support-forum thread rather than passing judgement on the whole region -- honestly I don't think that was the point of the thread from the very start.

 

Nobody is expecting Glasgow and Edinburgh to look like paywhere addons.  Let's get that behind us.  Sure when I get a little more spending cash I'll get the UK2000 renditions of these two airports, but these are certainly better than the FSX versions.

 

John, I cannot think of ANY other forum on the internet or elsewhere which praises a company for it's products more than what goes on here on a daily basis.  Here you just seemed a bit defensive today, which is normally not you.  One poster had some issues, which in my view shows clearly that the product is not installed as it should be, and that may well be due to interference with someother scenery or some mesh or textures or something.  The whole thread just reads like a string of misunderstandings.

 

Now I am going back to reivsit these airports and look for the odd and out of place and see what I can find.  But in all likelihood, I will end up just posting a string of screenshots that I actually feel pretty good about. 

[Ripcord]

OK I won't say it looks odd, but there does seem to be a few areas, mostly green areas, in between the terminal and a couple of the parking areas, that do not seem well connected.  I might use another term here like 'abrupt' or 'disjointed'.  Doesn't blend together as well as most the FTX airports I have grown accustomed to.  You know, now that I look at it harder, I almost get the feeling that it wasn't quite finished, to be honest -- like the designer was really going for some serious detail there and just didn't get it all put together.  The parts that are there look almost photo real -- I compared it with Google Earth.  I guess the only knock on this is the parts aren't well connected, IMHO.  Overall looks fine.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not looking for a payware quality scenery, and really not complaining about this one, but I would not hold this up to the same standard as say FTX Brisbane or FTX Portland Oregon or FTX Auckland or FTX Christchurch.  In fact I would say FTX Glasgow is better.  And I only say that because of a few gaps in the textures.  I would also not say it is a lot worse either.  Just a marginal difference here.

 

Does it take away a lot from the overall positive impression that FTX Scotland makes?  No, I didn't even notice it until I saw this thread.  Hardly worth mentioning really.

 

Anyway I really prefer to have the additional detail in the smaller airports, which is what ORBX provided in this release.  I was planning to do payware big airports anyway, at some point, but this is better than much of what is out there.

 

EDIT:  as I predicted, a string of screenshots that I feel pretty good about.

[FleetingThought]

OK I won't say it looks odd, but there does seem to be a few areas, mostly green areas, in between the terminal and a couple of the parking areas, that do not seem well connected. I might use another term here like 'abrupt' or 'disjointed'. Doesn't blend together as well as most the FTX airports I have grown accustomed to. You know, now that I look at it harder, I almost get the feeling that it wasn't quite finished, to be honest -- like the designer was really going for some serious detail there and just didn't get it all put together. The parts that are there look almost photo real -- I compared it with Google Earth. I guess the only knock on this is the parts aren't well connected, IMHO. Overall looks fine.

Not looking for a payware quality scenery, and really not complaining about this one, but I would not hold this up to the same standard as say FTX Brisbane or FTX Portland Oregon or FTX Auckland or FTX Christchurch. In fact I would say FTX Glasgow is better. And I only say that because of a few gaps in the textures. I would also not say it is a lot worse either. Just a marginal difference here.

Does it take away a lot from the overall positive impression that FTX Scotland makes? No, I didn't even notice it until I saw this thread. Hardly worth mentioning really.

Anyway I really prefer to have the additional detail in the smaller airports, which is what ORBX provided in this release. I was planning to do payware big airports anyway, at some point, but this is better than much of what is out there.

EDIT: as I predicted, a string of screenshots that I feel pretty good about.

Those skirts around the jetways look like a problem in the install? I'm using REX textures and it supersedes the default textures there, so haven't seen this. Are you using any 3rd-party add-ons for scenery other than ORBX?

[John Venema]

I do apologise for my short temper yesterday, don't know what came over me to be honest.

Perhaps we can enhance this area by doing a payware Edinburgh then?

[WilliamJSS]

I will trade you John.

Do a couple areas for Portugal when Global is released. And I will buy that airport if you make it😄

Sent from my Apple communications device.

[rockliffe]

Hey JV, we all know there's 'another' payware Edinburgh, which I'm sure you'll agree is more than competent. OK, it wouldn't fit as seamlessly as an Orbx airport, but nevertheless there's still an excellent alternative for people. Perhaps I could ask, is it possible, without undertaking large amounts of work, to perhaps pay a little more attention around the perimiters of some of the larger airports?    

[John Dow]

I was just visiting Edinburgh so I thought I'd knock up a couple of screenshots to illustrate the FTX version compared to the default.

 

 

 

 

The FTX version is better than the default.  Not much perhaps, but it is better.  As a regional pack, FTX Scotland was never intended to deliver more than 'landclass' and 'regional' enhancements to the scenery.

 

I think they have accomplished that in a very spectacular fashion.  Looking across to the distance in the above screenshots confirms it.

 

From a beta testers viewpoint, when testing Scotland I flew over Edinburgh a couple of times.  My remit was to check the scenery for missing, incomplete or out of place scenery.  At no time did I form the view that the airport as portrayed was not a satisfactory representation for someone using it as either a place to land or as a VFR point during navigation.

 

Cheers

[rockliffe]

Hi John, sure, I think we all agree about the scenery product as a whole being simpy awesome, but I don't think it's unreasonable to ask or suggest if the textures surrounding some of these airports could be tidied up a little. I think the problem essentially lies in the fact that the rest of the scenery is beautiful, with some great textures but it's let down a little be the way the textures in question are displayed. 

[kaboki]

Well, if that's correct scenery, then I won't be getting Scotland. And I don't have Wales, so my expectations haven't been effected by that. They are set by all the non-payware airports in the NA and AU scenery, which look much more natural and realistic. Not payware quality, of course, but also no random, oddly shaped, poor renditions of buildings and parking lots. I'd say what I see above is certainly no improvement over default.

 

 

Don't let this one airport affect your decision to buy, this is the only one so far that I tought looked abit odd(other aiports looks great, ). Rest of the country looks so nice. I would say it looks better than PNW and not getting this you will miss out some great scenery. Scotland has become my new favorite place to fly.(and I useally don't fly in regions until payware airports are available)  Your loss...

[GlennH]

I do apologise for my short temper yesterday, don't know what came over me to be honest.

Perhaps we can enhance this area by doing a payware Edinburgh then?

EGPH at orbx standards, especially with proper colour matching of textures (why i won't get Uk 2000 airports) would be a winner IMHO

[rockliffe]

Don't let this one airport affect your decision to buy, this is the only one so far that I tought looked abit odd(other aiports looks great, ). Rest of the country looks so nice. I would say it looks better than PNW and not getting this you will miss out some great scenery. Scotland has become my new favorite place to fly.(and I useally don't fly in regions until payware airports are available)  Your loss...

 

I agree...

[Doog79]

I must admit that I was a little surprised by the lack of imagination for EGPH especially because so much work went into the city and photscenery which is excellent by the way.   EGPH (Edinburgh) is Scotlands capital city and is just behind Glasgow in aircraft movements, trust me its busy I stay on the approach path lol   Not bashing it just think a few more buildings and the unique ATC tower which can be seen from high points all over Edinburgh should have been included. It looks marginally better than default just now.

 

No biggie for me as I have the other payware for EGPH but would really like to see either a payware EGPH from OrbX or at least a little upgrade to the current version.

 

Can not get enough of the scenery other than that. 

 

Doogie

[FleetingThought]

I'd buy ORBX EGPH in a heartbeat. Glasgow, too.

[Dr_Watson]

Also a bit surprised at the way the airport turned out.  On a whole, there are parts I love in Scotland and plenty of parts I then are poor.  The tiling effect for car parks (which don´t exist in real life unless the market has a lucky busy day) look very strange.  Some other places look great and I am really surprised at how well some of the military bases look.  I just did a flight around Tobermory and Fort William and both are represented by a tile which sits at an angle and slopes into the sea.  This was a major issue with England so I wasn´t expecting the same thing with Scotland.  Surely this tile could be rotated so the roads at least run parallel to the coast to make it look vaguely like a town. 

[Ripcord]

Don't let this one airport affect your decision to buy, this is the only one so far that I tought looked abit odd(other aiports looks great, ). Rest of the country looks so nice. I would say it looks better than PNW and not getting this you will miss out some great scenery. Scotland has become my new favorite place to fly.(and I useally don't fly in regions until payware airports are available)  Your loss...

 

Oh fergawdsake, whoever is lurking out there reading this and contemplating the purchase, definately don't let this be a factor in your decision.  This is so incredibly minor, you would hardly notice it and it's an outlier that is not representative of teh whole region, and at the end of the day it is probably something that could be easily addressed in a patch if they decided to do that.  There was a spot there and there in England that needed a bit of touch-up and some paint, after all.

 

Honestly I just get the feeling that somebody left out a background file or something (?)

 

John, I appreciate the drive to excel, but not sure about the full on payware airport for this one.  Let me say why.

 

Probably better off working in cooperation with Gary rather than opening direct competition with him (just a thought, certainly I am not qualified to give you pointers on how to run the business).  Just seem like he has the 'first mover advantages', having a product already on the market ready to go, and there are way too many other airports to do -- even in Scotland.  I am one of many here that believe you have a sound strategy in small-medium size regional airports where your crazy-talented artists can really go in and pump in full metric sh*t-ton of detail.  That is the hallmark of the ORBX airport.  Again, this is offered as encouragement and agreement, not as advice, because I like your vision and your road map is based in good sense/logic.  Stay the course.

[Neil Hill]

Hi all,

 

If I had released an EGPH that looked like those first two screenshots from Sue I would have been ashamed and I don't blame her for wanting better.  However after looking closely at those screenshots I finally figured out what was wrong, the default EGPH was "superimposed" on our released version, no wonder she saw so many default buildings. Screenshots by others later down the thread were correct.

 

The criticism of the car park textures along the rwy I tend to agree with (they are not part of the airport) so I've done a quick revision that will show up in the first SP.   It ties those car parks (turned into plain asphalt, that big one towards the end of the rwy 06 looks like a busy day at a car swap meet anyway) with roads to the main road along with a few added details closer to the main terminal.

 

While it's true that we don't put a lot of detail into the very large airports what is there is quite accurate and indeed should look better than those first 2 screenshots of Sue.

 

Cheers, Neil

[rockliffe]

Top man Neil, well done, appreciated by all I'm sure.

[fltsimguy]

Neil thanks for taking the time to review the concern and putting forward the effort to make some adjustment.  It is much appreciated.

[Dr_Watson]

Great Neil.

[FleetingThought]

Much appreciated!

[Doog79]

Thankyou Neil

[Nick_H]

I do apologise for my short temper yesterday, don't know what came over me to be honest.

Perhaps we can enhance this area by doing a payware Edinburgh then?

 

That would be good for me )

[Sid]

I'd buy ORBX EGPH in a heartbeat. Glasgow, too.

Me too! I'd line up for one of those each too! Orbx Edinburgh & Glasgow! I'm so pleased Aberdeen's been announced too.

[Penzoil3]

Ok Neil, thanks. But how do I fix it?  Do I need to re install Scotland, or what?  I switched to default FSX before installing as the readme said, and I've switched back to default, and back to Europe, to try and fix it.  Then I started this mess.  Didn't mean to open such a kettle of fish, just thought it didn't look right.  From what you say, it isn't.-

   "However after looking closely at those screenshots I finally figured out what was wrong, the default EGPH was "superimposed" on our released version, no wonder she saw so many default buildings."

 

  Scotland is beautiful, don't misunderstand please.  I just want to get rid of the default bleed through.

  Thanks

    Sue

[bruce e]

Ok Neil, thanks. But how do I fix it? ................................

 

Neil said,              "................ so I've done a quick revision that will show up in the first SP.  "