active Germany North/South Long Loading Times and OOM/CDT crash...

[alexmish]

Hi Orbx team,

   First, thanks for developing such great products - I have most of your products, and truly enjoying them (the install base is over 300GB just for Orbx stuff :).

 

   Now, I've recently purchased Germany North and Sound packages (in addition to Global Base, Global Vector, and Global openLC Europe - in the same "region").  Installed, configured, etc.  I have latest-n-greatest HW to handle it - i9-10900K, 32GB RAM, M.2 1TB SDD and RTX3080 with 10GB VRAM, and I am running Windows 10Pro and P3D v5.1HF1.  The HW and OS and P3Dv5HF1 install are "brand new" - within past couple of weeks, from a clean slate, no legacy...

 

  When I try to start the sim at an airport within Germany North/South (e.g. EDDF or EDDM or EDDT), the sim loading takes over 20 mins to progress to the point of "~65% - Loading autogen", and once it starts to load autogen, it quickly progresses from using about 6GB or RAM to full 32GB (within 20 seconds), at which point it just CTDs... Disabling both North/South Germany add-ons returns it back to "normal" behavior - relatively quick load within 1 minute, 6GB or RAM in use, etc.  And I tried this both with default P3D airports (e.g. Hamburg in my case), as well as with more advanced add-ons, such as Mega Airport Frankfurt (P3D v5 version).

 

  My graphics settings are (almost all) maxed to the right, with the exception of Autogen density for radius, vegetation and buildings - these are set to just High.

 

Please advise how I can troubleshoot this.

 

P.S. I also have TrueEarth North and South California, as well as Central and South Great Britain.  No issues there with load times and memory usage.

[Cedrico89]

Can anyone help me out with this Problem ist must be an Problem with the Germany South and North 

Greetings Cedric

 

 

 

[mfannee]

@Cedrico89

 

You should look at this topic:

 

[alexmish]

Bump, any response to the OP?

[carlosqr]

14 minutes ago, alexmish said:

Bump, any response to the OP?

 

I would dare to say it is a limitation of P3D v5 and how it uses the Vas memory and directx12, if settings are high or products too demanding of resources it will easily crash.

 

I was not even able to start a flight in DD NYC with PMD and forget about enabling the "weather enhancement stuff" it will simply close.

 

For me it never worked, I had showers of issues, CTD, not able to access the video card, etc, etc, etc until I uninstalled it and kept V4.5 though I hardly launch it.

 

Set your settings to default and test if that allows you to fly and have a "descent" performance. If yes then you know what the issue is for sure because your system is really good.

 

Cheers

Carlos

 

 

 

[alexmish]

I get the sim running just fine in all other areas and settings.  I also have DD NYC, Seattle, Miami, etc - no issues there.

 

The issue with Germany South/North seems to be very specific to that particular scenery.  Lowering settings on the sim is not an option for me - all other Orbx packages work just fine with my existing settings.

[wain71]

did you look at the link in the above post? 

[Nick Cooper]

On 12/21/2020 at 10:14 PM, alexmish said:

I have latest-n-greatest HW to handle it - i9-10900K, 32GB RAM, M.2 1TB SDD and RTX3080 with 10GB VRAM, and I am running Windows 10Pro and P3D v5.1HF1.  The HW and OS and P3Dv5HF1 install are "brand new" - within past couple of weeks, from a clean slate, no legacy...

 

  When I try to start the sim at an airport within Germany North/South (e.g. EDDF or EDDM or EDDT), the sim loading takes over 20 mins to progress to the point of "~65% - Loading autogen", and once it starts to load autogen, it quickly progresses from using about 6GB or RAM to full 32GB (within 20 seconds), at which point it just CTDs... Disabling both North/South Germany add-ons returns it back to "normal" behavior - relatively quick load within 1 minute, 6GB or RAM in use, etc.  And I tried this both with default P3D airports (e.g. Hamburg in my case), as well as with more advanced add-ons, such as Mega Airport Frankfurt (P3D v5 version). 

 

Hello,

firstly, the PC hardware has nothing to do with this problem.

It will occur regardless of the specifications.

 

In short, there are some things that P3D v5 does that other versions do not and one of them is to index every single Vector file.

It does not do this every time but it does do so the first time it starts if Vector has been added after having been disabled.

 

There is a simple rule, that the more scenery that is added, the longer P3D will take to start.

As an example, if I load every Orbx product at the same time, it does indeed take at least 20 minutes before I can fly.

My answer is not to do that.

 

I have here loaded at EDDF, with just EU Germany North and South.

There are no addon airports.

You can see that the product is performing as it should and it loaded from an ordinary HDD from "cold" in 1 minute, 25 seconds.

 

In this case, these are the settings.

 

 

You can see that the VRAM usage is not excessive

2k image, click on it to enlarge it

 

Here is the same scene and the same settings but with EA active. You can see that as expected, more VRAM is in use but still not an excessive amount.

2k image, click on it to enlarge it

 

Here is a "worst case" image, zoomed out and some weather

2k image, click on it to enlarge it

 

I think that your answer is probably to manage your scenery carefully and load only that which you require for the flight that you intend to make.

 

 

[alexmish]

Hi Nick, thank you for the response. 

 

First of all, my issue with memory is running out of regular RAM, not VRAM... And the RAM usage stays within normal range until P3D gets to the point of loading Autogen - the regular RAM usage goes from 6GB to 32GB (my max memory) within 20 seconds, and then sim crashes.  So there must be ALSO something in the autogen specifications of these Germany scenery packs that causes this behavior.  Once I disable North or South Germany (so at that point it is just regular P3D + Orbx openLC Europe in that particular area + the rest of my addons), the load time is fine and autogen does not cause OOM condition.  Also, with North and South Germany enabled, if I load the sim at another country (e.g. UK or US), the start up time is OK, and there is no excessive memory usage.  So I don't think it is indexing, IMHO...

 

Also, I have over 120 various scenery add ons installed... Most of the Orbx scenery packs and large airports, plus over 90 other non-Orbx but hifi airports.  I also have TrueEarth for US West Coast and UK North/South - much larger size-wise packages.... With all of these (but No/So Germany still turned off), which account to ~500GB of scenery files, my load time is about 1.5 minutes... IT IS ONLY WHEN I TURN ON North and South Germany, that I have excessive load time and OOM crash (and I suspect because of the crash, the index does not get saved or something like that, so subsequent start ups are still very long).

 

I don't have any antivirus software installed... Windows Defender is off too, as this is my sim-only computer.  For the reference, I have a physical 737 cockpit build with ProSim737 and many other hardware pieces, as well as multiple PCs to support all of that... So I am not just a random gamer with a PC + Joystick.  See the pic.

 

So "manage your scenery carefully" is not something that I was looking to do... I already have too many packages even without Germany, and I doubt adding these 2 could result in such a drastic behavior. If these sceneries are just not ready for prime time, I'll just ask for refund...

 

P.S. I am happy on jump on a zoom call with Orbx support to troubleshoot/explore other paths... If that is an option.  I am in US/Eastern time zone.

Edited December 23, 2020 by alexmish

[Nick Cooper]

Hello,

could you perhaps try using just the Orbx EU Germany North and South and the Orbx Libraries and see

whether that on its own results in your sudden use of all your RAM and of course the 20 minute loading time?

Orbx Germany for P3D is not a new or experimental product and certainly does not routinely cause this kind of problem.

The indexing problem is, as far as I am aware, only with Vector and it is of course not needed inside Orbx Regions.

[alexmish]

I will give it a try later today or tomorrow, and will reply.  I need to figure out how to do that in a "safe and reversible" way

[Nick Cooper]

Hello,

whether you have installed your products inside the simulator, or outside in an Orbx Central Library,

the easiest and entirely reversible way is to simply untick everything else, in either the scenery library or

the add-ons list respectively.

 

There are two freeware programs that make this even easier but I guess that you may already be familiar with them.

For the record, sitting on the ground at default EDDF in the DDW C-47, P3D v5 on my system is using 6166 GB of system RAM.

Flying with EA active and Orbx 7 weather, this rises to around 6600 GB.

[alexmish]

Hi Nick, I've narrowed it down to conflict with Orbx openLC Europe.  When I disabled openLC EU, and enabled either or both North and South Germany, the load times are normal (full load sequence is about 2.5 minutes first time) and there are no issues with OOM conditions.  The moment I've turned the openLC EU "on" (with either North or South Germany still turned on), I got veeeeeery long load time (I had to kill at at 17% as it wasn't moving for 10 mins, even though CPU was 100% utilization, although 0% for the disk utilization!).

 

So there you go, it is something between openLC EU and these Germany packs.  As they overlap the same map area, I wonder if there are compat issues.

 

I also have Mega Airport Frankfurt, enabling or disabling it made no difference to the above experiment.

 

Next Steps?

 

[Schleckinspektor]

I have the same issue like @alexmish. Would be good to have a solution provided by Orbx.

 

Right now OpenLC and Germany South/North can not be used together.

Edited January 17, 2021 by Schleckinspektor

[B77X]

On 12/23/2020 at 3:47 PM, alexmish said:

Hi Nick, I've narrowed it down to conflict with Orbx openLC Europe.  When I disabled openLC EU, and enabled either or both North and South Germany, the load times are normal (full load sequence is about 2.5 minutes first time) and there are no issues with OOM conditions.  The moment I've turned the openLC EU "on" (with either North or South Germany still turned on), I got veeeeeery long load time (I had to kill at at 17% as it wasn't moving for 10 mins, even though CPU was 100% utilization, although 0% for the disk utilization!).

 

So there you go, it is something between openLC EU and these Germany packs.  As they overlap the same map area, I wonder if there are compat issues.

 

I also have Mega Airport Frankfurt, enabling or disabling it made no difference to the above experiment.

 

Next Steps?

 

remove EDDF bgls in Orbx Germany South and all other addon airports with scenery

uncheck bathemetry p3d option

[B77X]

On 1/17/2021 at 6:08 AM, Schleckinspektor said:

I have the same issue like @alexmish. Would be good to have a solution provided by Orbx.

 

Right now OpenLC and Germany South/North can not be used together.

same to you read my above post. disable files for addon airports and unhceck bathemetry

[Schleckinspektor]

Hi B77X,

 

thanks for your tip. I deactivated all files that are related to addon sceneries in that area. Bathymetry is off. I still have excessive loading times ("Loading terrain data") and P3D crashs at around 70% (when loading EDDF).

 

Any further ideas?

 

 

[Nick Cooper]

Hello,

if P3D loads correctly, if slowly, without EDDF, could there be something that loads with that, an AI

aircraft perhaps, that could be causing the crash?

[Schleckinspektor]

Hi Nick,

 

i am not sure. After uninstallation of Germany South P3D loads quickly as usual and of course no crash.

 

Max

Edited January 20, 2021 by Schleckinspektor

[mattrich]

I didn’t want to start a new post, as my issue and resolve is the same as the OPs. I purchased Germany North/South a couple of days ago, to my long collection of Orbx sceneries. I loaded my first flight at EDDL and OOM at 66% of the sim loading. I thought this may have been a random issue, so I did a reboot and the same issue occurred. I verified my files and synced the sim, still the same issue. Doing a search I found this thread. The only way I can use Germany North/South is to deactivate OpenLC Europe. I’ve tested many other Orbx areas and no issues, it’s just Germany North/South with OpenLC Europe.

 

Is there a fix for this or will I have to keep either OpenLC Europe or Germany North/South deactivated?

 

System and sim in my signature

Edited June 19, 2021 by mattrich

[03wale]

Hello, found this thread when I ran into the same issue. The only way I can spawn at EDDF in v5 is by disabling Germany North and South. However, arriving into Frankfurt with these enabled doesn't cause the OOM/CTD.

 

 

Wale

[Flying Steve]

Hi guys,

 

is there an update for this topic?

because i am having this same issue

 

Orbx cant tell us to just run without OpenLC Europe right?

 

Please Orbx can you provide us with an update? 

[Doug Sawatzky]

Hi, welcome to the forums

 

I have just tried it at all three EDDF, EDDM, EDDT, and all loaded up in under 60 seconds with no other issues or any hardware usage abnormality.

[Flying Steve]

13 hours ago, Doug Sawatzky said:

Hi, welcome to the forums

 

I have just tried it at all three EDDF, EDDM, EDDT, and all loaded up in under 60 seconds with no other issues or any hardware usage abnormality.

Hi Doug, Thx

 

do you have OpenLC Europe and Germany North/South running together?

and are you running P3Dv5.2

 

I had zero issues with all my scenery and current hardware.

but after installing Germany North and South i cant load into EDDF or EDDM.

 

[Doug Sawatzky]

Hi

 

Yes I have everything installed and activated in P3Dv5.2, and everything is installed to the root simulator Orbx folder.

 

I realize that's not very helpful, but it does not seem to be a wide spread issue, and there may be another common denominator amongst those that are having the issue that we could not possibly foresee.

[John Dow]

Just tested this, I have Open LC Europe, Germany North and South, and Vector, all active.

 

Load times normal, about 1 - 1 1/2 minutes in the R22 from the welcome screen.

 

My guess is the problem is a mismatch or conflict between the various sceneries you have and the Orbx scenery, and if that is the case there's not much that Orbx can do to help.

 

In this case I would recommend unticking every bit of non-default scenery in your libraries and just have the default P3D scenery plus Open LC Europe, Germany North and South, and Vector, and see what happens.  If it still doesn't load properly there's maybe a deeper issue at work.

 

I remember waaay back in the VOZ and OZx days there were scenery crashes caused by duplicates in the GPS databases used in the sim and some addon GPS instruments that had their own databases.  Problems like that are nest to impossible to track down, I hope yours isn't as hard!

[Flying Steve]

Hi Guys,

 

after adjusting my inseration point in Orbx central the scenery would just loads like normal.

 

so that is the solution i've somebody have this issue.

 

thanks for the support guys.