i7 Rubbish

[Guest boeingqa]

Guys l carnt understand how upgrading my old system to a new rig is worse.

l had an e8500, $100 MB, 3 gig mem at 1066 with a xfx 9800gtx card l was getting no stutters and around in some places 100fps and 50.

now with a i7 920, $370 MB, 6 gig mem at 1600 ddr3, with a gtx 260 l`m now getting stutters and getting around 18 to 25 fps.

what the? l just carnt understand why. NOW l have seent his, when l run FSX then use CTRL, ALT and DELETE to get into Task manager

l see the cpu is at around 30% use and l see system idel process at 70%.. why isnt fsx using 100 or at least most of it.

thx guys

Paul

[Test Pilot]

Perhaps Windows is set to use low power/power saver mode? If so try it on max power (high energy usage) setting. S far as I now, system idol processes are ran when the computer doesnt think it;s too busy, or if it really feels the need to index some files or something...

[Tim Harris]

Tweaks?

tried some of this stuff?: http://orbxsystems.com/forums/index.php?topic=9908.0

[Sniper31]

Paul, your new system will run FSX great.....just hang in there and keep trying things to find out what the problem is. Make a checklist of possible causes and check off the one's you have tried to fix, and know did not help. It might be something simple. Do you have all of the right driver's installed? How does your new system run other programs? Is the low performence just in FSX, or other programs as well? It can be a trial and error thing, so hang in there and keep plugging. You should figure it out sooner or later.

[Guest boeingqa]

l`ll keep trying guys... l have the power mangement at high.... lets see what l come up with. thx guys

Paul

[randy]

Guys l carnt understand how upgrading my old system to a new rig is worse.

l had an e8500, $100 MB, 3 gig mem at 1066 with a xfx 9800gtx card l was getting no stutters and around in some places 100fps and 50.

now with a i7 920, $370 MB, 6 gig mem at 1600 ddr3, with a gtx 260 l`m now getting stutters and getting around 18 to 25 fps.

what the? l just carnt understand why. NOW l have seent his, when l run FSX then use CTRL, ALT and DELETE to get into Task manager

l see the cpu is at around 30% use and l see system idel process at 70%.. why isnt fsx using 100 or at least most of it.

thx guys

Paul

Paul,

  I don't know what M/B you are using but if you have your mem set to run at 1600 and don't have the CPU clocked things are not going to be at their best. At least that has been my findings with the 920 and the P6T Deluxe M/B. As a matter of fact in the bios when you try to change mem frequency and the CPU is not clocked you cannot run but at two freqs...I forget what they are and I am not at my PC now. You can set it to run at 1600 but from the manual and what I have read online that is not the best way to do it. ASUS is very clear that unclocked the setup is only for 1066 or 1333...I think those are the two freqs. But I suspect other M/B"s are going to be the same. If you don't clock and let the BIOS set up your mem freq it will not pick the best one. To get the full 1600 speed out of your mem you would have to run close to 4.0ghz and I don't think you are doing that yet. You also need to turn off Hyper Threading as it will not help at all. Sounds like you just have a few bugs to work out somewhere.....I am assuming you did this build yourself. Download CPUZ and it will tell you what your CPU and memory speed and timings are. The P6T Deluxe does not do a good job of setting correct timings for memory and you may have to set that yourself. Keep us posted and when I get back home tommorow I will look in my BIOS and tell you what my settings are at...not that you would want to use those but it will give you an idea. I don't know what your problem is but I can tell you I think you are going to really like the i7 once you get it going....you have the right VC and mem for it so I don't see why your machine shouldn't fly.

                                                          Regards 

[Russ White]

Dont forget, with FSX being an older application it relies mainly on the number crunching capability of the CPU which is directly related to it's clock speed (frequency).

Your old E8500 has a stock frequency of 3.16GHz, but the i920 has a stock frquency of 2.66GHz. That difference on it's own will have a big performance impact. Remember all the new technology included in the manufacture of the i920 is NOT used by FSX. Remmeber also that FSX didnt natively support more than one CPU core! it had to be patched to provide that feature, which is not as efficient as it could be. To get the best results in FSX, invest in a decent after market cooling solution for the CPU and over clock it up some so long as you feel comfortable doing that.

Russ.

[Guest boeingqa]

Yes l`ve just tryed that and it worked alittle. l`m hoping with windows 7 might help abit and future cpus..

You never know microsoft might still release a new flightsim..

Thx

Paul

[Xflyboy]

Paul,

I have an i7 @3.3 - 3.6, I found that the FSX Limiter and TBM & Bufferpools got rid of my stutters.

I would start with:

TEXTURE_BANDWIDTH_MULT=70 - 90

[bUFFERPOOLS]

PoolSize=200000000 - 490000000

I use 90/490000000 but I have the GTX 285

Turn off HT, and any power management running in the bios, also enable turbo boost, check that you ram is either 1066 or 1333mhz set in the bios.

I would start with normal/normal autogen and adjust the autogen up from there. I don't like the autogen maxed out, even if I could , to me it dosen't look realistic, but to each his own.

The i7 and GTX cards, cause a harder and more pronounce stutter affect. Try these setting with a saved flight and compare, and adjust.

Hope this helps.

[tim_A]

The big thing that set my i7 onto overdrive was nHancer. See NickN's tweaks over at Simviation - they're all good, but it was the nHancer settings that killed the stutters and really boosted it.

http://www.simviation.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1208959973

[Guest boeingqa]

Thx guys l have fsx on a different patition, l might reinstall it on the c: drive and make sure the ultimate defrag moves it to the front.

The HT you were talking about where would l find that in the bios? thx l have a gigabyte MB

l also have 1600 mem, but when l tweaked the cpu to 3.5 the mem went down. maybe l`m doing something wrong here

any help guys would be great. Still that darn ymml not the best, might have to unionstall it. l`m getting 7 to 10 fps in my pmdg 747.

the videocard l have is a GTX260 if this helps

Regards

Paul

[Heiko Glatthorn]

Your old E8500 has a stock frequency of 3.16GHz, but the i920 has a stock frquency of 2.66GHz.

Aye, that's called downgrade, not upgrade. Bring the 920 at least to 3.2 GHz to see an improvement.

[Guest boeingqa]

l have it at around 3.5, but the memory is at 1300 l think and not 1600 as thats what it is. any thoughts?

thx bud

[tim_A]

You won't see a performance benefit from having FSX on a different partition, but there is organisational benefit, and it's away from the C: drive, which is good. I would definitely NOT move it to the C: drive. You will see a benefit to putting FS on its own disc (esp. if it's a fast one) - separate spindle, separate R/w head, separate electronics - but it's not a "big" benefit though.

when l tweaked the cpu to 3.5 the mem went down. maybe l`m doing something wrong here

I saw the same thing. There seems to be very little information about clocking the i7 (other than the annoying "I did it" posts that never explain *how*). At the mo, I'm stopped on 3.4, but I'm sure I could go higher with help (it's too expensive a cpu just to poke and see what happens: I couldn't afford to replace it!)

[John Venema]

The big thing that set my i7 onto overdrive was nHancer. See NickN's tweaks over at Simviation - they're all good, but it was the nHancer settings that killed the stutters and really boosted it.

http://www.simviation.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1208959973

Er, avoid those tweaks like the plague. You'll just go down a miserable road of endless tweaking and frustration. There is no magic tweaking cure for FSX performance.

Here are the 4 keys to getting great FSX performance:

1. Get the fastest Quad-Core CPU you can afford. Overclock the bugger if you want to. 3Ghz is great, 4Ghz is best. The new i7's rock, and Intel has lots more of them coming; faster clocks, stronger, more cores. We love it

2. Get a GOOD current-gen video card. The nVidia GTX285 rules the roost right now. Make sure you get at least 768MB of DDR3 on, 1GB is best.

3. Get a Gigabyte motherboard (the best reputation, and they are good overclockers) and then run 2X Western Digitial Velociraptors 10,000 RPM (74GB) hard drives in RAID-0 off the motherboard.

4. Install Windows 7 Beta (if you can get it), if not wait for it and put up with Vista. Turn Microsoft Automatic Updates on and keep everything current

That's it!  No more dicking around and fiddling. Chuck decent hardware at FSX and it will reward you. Spent countless hours tweaking (following ridiculously obscure lists which need to be executed in strict order and rely on this version of that defragger, blah, blah) - my God! That's just going to age you prematurely and you'll walk away from FSX frustrated and looking for a new hobby instead.

[Guest boeingqa]

thx guys

Pau;l

[solareagle]

I don't know if you are still battling stutters, but I certainly was when I got my i7.  There's several work arounds....

1) Lock the framerate in-game. (comes with performance hit)

2) Lock the framerate with a 3rd party app like FPS_Limter. (no performance hit)

3) Set a Buffer Pool via the cfg to an extremely high value like 200-300MB. (needs lots of vram)

Also FSX does not support HT so you can disable Hyperthreading in the BIOS to help your overclock.  With HT disabled set an Affinity Mask of 15 in the cfg.

This is what I use on my 4.2GHz i7 with Autogen set to Extremely Dense and framerate set to unlimted, which is totally stutter free.  The Buffer Pool is the magic tweak, and without that I must use a framerate lock at a value I can consistently achieve to eliminate the stutters.

[DISPLAY]

TEXTURE_BANDWIDTH_MULT=110

[TERRAIN]

TERRAIN_MAX_AUTOGEN_TREES_PER_CELL=2400

TERRAIN_MAX_AUTOGEN_BUILDINGS_PER_CELL=1600

[bUFFERPOOLS]

PoolSize=300000000

[JOBSCHEDULER]

AffinityMask=15

[Sniper31]

I have to concur with what Lance said above. My I7 rig has NO stutters, and flight is nice and smooth.

[Tomaz Drnovsek]

The big thing that set my i7 onto overdrive was nHancer. See NickN's tweaks over at Simviation - they're all good, but it was the nHancer settings that killed the stutters and really boosted it.

http://www.simviation.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1208959973

Er, avoid those tweaks like the plague. You'll just go down a miserable road of endless tweaking and frustration. There is no magic tweaking cure for FSX performance.

Here are the 4 keys to getting great FSX performance:

1. Get the fastest Quad-Core CPU you can afford. Overclock the bugger if you want to. 3Ghz is great, 4Ghz is best. The new i7's rock, and Intel has lots more of them coming; faster clocks, stronger, more cores. We love it

2. Get a GOOD current-gen video card. The nVidia GTX285 rules the roost right now. Make sure you get at least 768MB of DDR3 on, 1GB is best.

3. Get a Gigabyte motherboard (the best reputation, and they are good overclockers) and then run 2X Western Digitial Velociraptors 10,000 RPM (74GB) hard drives in RAID-0 off the motherboard.

4. Install Windows 7 Beta (if you can get it), if not wait for it and put up with Vista. Turn Microsoft Automatic Updates on and keep everything current

That's it!  No more dicking around and fiddling. Chuck decent hardware at FSX and it will reward you. Spent countless hours tweaking (following ridiculously obscure lists which need to be executed in strict order and rely on this version of that defragger, blah, blah) - my God! That's just going to age you prematurely and you'll walk away from FSX frustrated and looking for a new hobby instead.

Here's the deal..  I just bought myself a new machine... Gigabyte GA-EX58-UD4, i7 920 OC@3,2GHz, RAM DDRIII 1600 MHz, Nvidia Geforce 9600GT 512MB (ok, VC is from my old machine), Windows 7 RTM, FSX with Acceleration.

So according to your post I should be good to go... I was so excited when I was installing everything on my new system... I launched FSX, set the settings, load an airport, looked at my FPS... 80... great!!! Than I starded flying... and I became depresed... horrible horrible stutters all the time!!! I locked FPS with FPS limiter, I turned off HT, set affinity mask on 15... a little better... but still horrible! FSX on my old rig (AMD 2,2.. something old) was running better and smoother.. with only 10FPS.

There can't be any conflicts or problems with software because I installed Windows 7 just two days ago. It's all fresh. I don't know what to do anymore... I tired all the tweaks that are supposed to work... HT, affinity mask... and I still can't fly without headaches. This i7 is making me thirsty!

[Heiko Glatthorn]

That 9600 GT must be the mother of all bottlenecks...

[Tomaz Drnovsek]

I know... but worse stutters than on my old system with the same VC? I find this really strange.. FSX on my new system is practicaly unplayable. Can this be just because of VC? Really? I will buy myself a better one in a while but you understand my concern.. the one I have right now is not great but it's not rubbish either.. if I buy a real badboy (a good one and it doesn't help with these stutters I throw away almost 1000€ for all these toys for what?! So I can play Solitaire?

[Maurice_King]

"0Arthur0"  according to all the guff on many different hardware forums, you have a ferrari for the main Board with a VW engine as the Graphics card , there is NO possible way the 9600 can keep up with the i7 and main board set up you have.

I've yet to be convinced that an i7 is worth a damn when performance v cost is compared.

[Tomaz Drnovsek]

So, in your opinion if I buy a better GPU it would eliminate these stutters? Is GeForce GTS 250 1024MB GDDR 3 enough?? I costs 140€... right now I don't have the bucks to buy a GTX 285 or something like that.

[Maurice_King]

Yes mate I believe the Graphics card is what is holding your system back.  I think the GTX250 would be a significant improvement.

[Tomaz Drnovsek]

Don't forget I already have 60FPS average (no addons yet). The only problem are these strange stutters.

[Heiko Glatthorn]

Set your TEXTURE_BANDWIDTH_MULT to 40, lock your FPS at 30

For extremely dense autogen try

TERRAIN_MAX_AUTOGEN_TREES_PER_CELL=1000

TERRAIN_MAX_AUTOGEN_BUILDINGS_PER_CELL=1000

Enable vsync in your nVidia CP or better nHancer.

Bufferpools is the last what you try - first everything else has to be o.k..

[abulaafia]

Be careful with the [bUFFERPOOLS] tweak. It has a really pronounced negative effect on my new i7 + 285 system with the latest nvidia drivers. With Bufferpools over 100 MB, I lose 30-50 % FPS and get massive stutters.

If you are buying a new system, forget all the tweaks out there and ESPECIALLY the "famous" tweaking guide by Nick N. It's old news and only reduces performance, including the overhyped nhancer. John is right when he dismisses all those tweaks.

[Tomaz Drnovsek]

Hm... there are a few quite extensive posts about BUFFERPOOLS tweak.. people who have VC with 768 MBor more report massive improvement using this tweak (set 200M-300M).. they say stutters can't be achieved even if you try.. I was hoping this tweak would help if I buy new VC. But for people with less than 768 MB this tweak is just trouble. That's what they say.

So, you're not using nHancer at all? Do you use nvidia control panel to set AA and all those things?

Do you get any stutters with your i7? What RAM do you have if it's no secret?

Really, I'm loosing my mind because of those darn stutters on brand new system with no tweaks.

@Mango: I'll try that when I come home.. I'll report back.

[Heiko Glatthorn]

With Bufferpools over 100 MB, I lose 30-50 % FPS and get massive stutters.

This depends on your GPU, the all over system performance and FSX settings. With vRAM less than 768 MB i would be very careful.

O.k., Artur - it won't hurt. Maybe it works 

[abulaafia]

I think its more than that. I have a 285 with 1GB. The BUFFERPOOLS worked until the latest nvidia drivers 190.38. That version runs very smooth on my system, but adding BUFFERPOOL causes massive stutters.

[MarkH]

talling everything on my new system... I launched FSX, set the settings, load an airport, looked at my FPS... 80... horrible horrible stutters all the time!!!

Can I suggest you try turning off AA altogether and see what your performance is like? This sounds a bit like my own 'upgrade' experience, and the video card was the bottleneck.

[Goober]

Here's the deal..  I just bought myself a new machine... Gigabyte GA-EX58-UD4, i7 920 OC@3,2GHz, RAM DDRIII 1600 MHz, Nvidia Geforce 9600GT 512MB (ok, VC is from my old machine), Windows 7 RTM, FSX with Acceleration.

So according to your post I should be good to go... I was so excited when I was installing everything on my new system... I launched FSX, set the settings, load an airport, looked at my FPS... 80... great!!! Than I starded flying... and I became depresed... horrible horrible stutters all the time!!! I locked FPS with FPS limiter, I turned off HT, set affinity mask on 15... a little better... but still horrible! FSX on my old rig (AMD 2,2.. something old) was running better and smoother.. with only 10FPS.

There can't be any conflicts or problems with software because I installed Windows 7 just two days ago. It's all fresh. I don't know what to do anymore... I tired all the tweaks that are supposed to work... HT, affinity mask... and I still can't fly without headaches. This i7 is making me thirsty!

Are you having this prob with other games, or just just FS ? and how long from when you start playing FS does the prob start  (in sec or min) Thinking thinking thinking for you, must be so annoying.

[jlund]

Sorry to jump in here, but after reading about changing buffertools etc. I was wondering in which .cfg file I find this and where is the path to it on a Windows 7 where FSX is installed on my E:drive (E:\FSX)?

I'm using the default driver in Windows 7, but will I be better off with a new NVidia driver and then, what version?

Regards Jlund

[jnrjim67]

Its in the \Users\(your user name)\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\FSX  but the AppData is hidden by default and if it is go to menu Organise->Folder and Search Options-> go to View Tab and select Show hidden files Folders and Drives.

[Heiko Glatthorn]

Yes indeed, the drivers can affect this tweak as well.

[jlund]

I tried applying the bufferpool line with a poolsize of 300000000, but I got some studders that I didn't have without it, so I deleted it again. It's not perfect, but the game is enjoyable now. However, I only have the Blue Region and with default YSSY and YMML I have FPS ranging from approx 12-sixty something. I would like to buy an AI addon (Traffic tools 2, Traffic X, MyTrafficX) but I'm afraid that it will kill my fps in dense areas. If I install ORBX's AI traffic pack 2, can I keep it if I decide to buy a commercial AI tool or will they collide with each other?

PS: Which NVidia driver version do you recommend instead of the one that came with Windows 7?

Jlund

[Maurice_King]

Considering the range for good results according to Mr Taylor after SP1  is between 4 and 10 Mb  or 4000000 - 10000000 I'd say the  300000000 in your post is way outside the range that FSX can utilise but I could be wrong with the range allowed.

There are threads in forums that claim the Time Fibre Frame tweak is only for single core Machines, well I'll disput that veremently as this was the thing that made my system come alive.

Assigning a different time fraction of available process time to do stuff. Works a treat on my Core Duo E6850 3ghz

[jlund]

UPS, my mistake. I have put a zero too much in the post in here, it was with poolsize 30000000, so I might try some other values to see if it makes any difference.

[Maurice_King]

That's what tweaking is all about  , you change a setting and check what it is doing eventually you will find the sweet spot that really makes your sim come alive.

[petejohno]

Maurice,

          I was wondering what your setting for the time fibre tweak was ? I have a system almost identical to yours and would appreciate your settings. I find very good performance with the E6850 at stock 3ghz but have not tried this tweak on this CPU.