Spirit Flyer_old Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Intel just announced in a news release that there is a serious flaw in their P67 chipset. Apparently the boards produced so far have a design flaw that may deteriorate performance over time. Here is the release: Quote: SANTA CLARA, Calif., Jan. 31, 2011 - As part of ongoing quality assurance, Intel Corporation has discovered a design issue in a recently released support chip, the Intel® 6 Series, code-named Cougar Point, and has implemented a silicon fix. In some cases, the Serial-ATA (SATA) ports within the chipsets may degrade over time, potentially impacting the performance or functionality of SATA-linked devices such as hard disk drives and DVD-drives. The chipset is utilized in PCs with Intel's latest Second Generation Intel Core processors, code-named Sandy Bridge. Intel has stopped shipment of the affected support chip from its factories. Intel has corrected the design issue, and has begun manufacturing a new version of the support chip which will resolve the issue. The Sandy Bridge microprocessor is unaffected and no other products are affected by this issue. The company expects to begin delivering the updated version of the chipset to customers in late February and expects full volume recovery in April. Intel stands behind its products and is committed to product quality. For computer makers and other Intel customers that have bought potentially affected chipsets or systems, Intel will work with its OEM partners to accept the return of the affected chipsets, and plans to support modifications or replacements needed on motherboards or systems. The systems with the affected support chips have only been shipping since January 9th and the company believes that relatively few consumers are impacted by this issue. The only systems sold to an end customer potentially impacted are Second Generation Core i5 and Core i7 quad core based systems. Intel believes that consumers can continue to use their systems with confidence, while working with their computer manufacturer for a permanent solution. For further information consumers should contact Intel at www.intel.com on the support page or contact their OEM manufacturer. For the first quarter of 2011, Intel expects this issue to reduce revenue by approximately $300 million as the company discontinues production of the current version of the chipset and begins manufacturing the new version. Full-year revenue is not expected to be materially affected by the issue. Total cost to repair and replace affected materials and systems in the market is estimated to be $700 million. Since this issue affected some of the chipset units shipped and produced in the fourth quarter of 2010, the company will take a charge against cost of goods sold, which is expected to reduce the fourth quarter gross margin percentage by approximately 4 percentage points from the previously reported 67.5 percent. The company will also take a charge in the first quarter of 2011which will lower the previously communicated gross margin percentage by 2 percentage points and the full-year gross margin percentage by one percentage point. Unquote http://newsroom.intel.com/community/intel_newsroom/blog/2011/01/31/intel-identifies-chipset-design-error-implementing-solution What this means to those of us that already built on these boards or ordered them is not yet known but likely users will be supported by the board makers and reimbursed by Intel as part of the $700,000,000 allocation. Meanwhile all works well on this machine and most others. Stand by for more information as it becomes available from major motherboard manufacturers and major wholesale and retail distributers. Kind regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alainneedle1 Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Now that's not tooo good, we are not talking about a manufacturing flaw here but a design flaw....look like Intel will take the pole position as far as recall over Toyota..... Seriously that's a bummer for everybody who got a board with this problem... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Attwood Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Now that's not tooo good, we are not talking about a manufacturing flaw here but a design flaw....look like Intel will take the pole position as far as recall over Toyota..... Seriously that's a bummer for everybody who got a board with this problem... Is that a smirk I see playing around your mouth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alainneedle1 Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Now that's not tooo good, we are not talking about a manufacturing flaw here but a design flaw....look like Intel will take the pole position as far as recall over Toyota..... Seriously that's a bummer for everybody who got a board with this problem... Is that a smirk I see playing around your mouth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spirit Flyer_old Posted January 31, 2011 Author Share Posted January 31, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain Emms Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Im sorry to read this i just hope you chaps that have upgraded dont have any problems and that you can get it sorted by RMA if something does go wrong but its not to say you will have problems i know the sinking feeling only to well when things dont work as they should. Good luck to you. cheers Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Venema Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Affects *some* desktops only, not laptops. This update: Update: Jimmy sent us a chat log with an Intel customer service representative indicating that this recall only affects "some desktop boards based on Intel P67 chipset," that the H67 chipset boards appear to not be affected, but that the company doesn't have a comprehensive list yet. We've certainly seen cases where CSRs don't have all the info in this sort of situation, but still we'd advise waiting a bit before tearing your new mobo out and bringing it back to the store. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMaestro Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 AnandTech is reporting it affects both. I just got off the phone with Intel’s Steve Smith (VP and Director of Intel Client PC Operations and Enabling) and got some more detail on this morning’s 6-series chipset/SATA bug. The Problem Cougar Point (Intel’s 6-series chipsets: H67/P67) has two sets of SATA ports: four that support 3Gbps operation, and two that support 6Gbps operation. Each set of ports requires its own PLL source. The problem in the chipset was traced back to a transistor in the 3Gbps PLL clocking tree. The aforementioned transistor has a very thin gate oxide, which allows you to turn it on with a very low voltage. Unfortunately in this case Intel biased the transistor with too high of a voltage, resulting in higher than expected leakage current. Depending on the physical characteristics of the transistor the leakage current here can increase over time which can ultimately result in this failure on the 3Gbps ports. The fact that the 3Gbps and 6Gbps circuits have their own independent clocking trees is what ensures that this problem is limited to only ports 2 - 5 off the controller. You can coax the problem out earlier by testing the PCH at increased voltage and temperature levels. By increasing one or both of these values you can simulate load over time and that’s how the problem was initially discovered. Intel believes that any current issues users have with SATA performance/compatibility/reliability are likely unrelated to the hardware bug. ... Final Words OEMs and motherboard manufacturers are going to be talking to Intel over the next week to figure out the next steps. Intel plans to deliver fixed silicon to its partners at the end of February, however it’ll still take time for the motherboard makers to turn those chips into products. I wouldn’t expect replacements until March at the earliest. Link to the article. I was planning on getting a new laptop and was seriously considering waiting until mainstream mobile Sandy Bridge models came out, but this issue will have delayed them by at least 3-4 weeks, which is too late for me. Bummer. Cheers, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heiko Glatthorn Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Oups... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumsonly2002 Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 So.... if you only use 2 Sata ports, the uneffected ones, good to go? Will it damage a SSD? If one used a PCI slot for a SSD IBIS, or Revo drive, is that effected? So, users of only 2 sata ports (the good ones), not effected? Thus the problem isn't that big of a deal under certain conditions? My S/B computer is FSX only thus not on 24/7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plexi1 Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 if I got this right, the SATA performance will degrade over years, if this really is true, I have no problem with it, I use my MoBos mostly for just one or two years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjjallen Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Just 6 months for me! Gotta keep the economy juiced. LOL jja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjjallen Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 So.... if you only use 2 Sata ports, the uneffected ones, good to go? Will it damage a SSD? If one used a PCI slot for a SSD IBIS, or Revo drive, is that effected? So, users of only 2 sata ports (the good ones), not effected? Thus the problem isn't that big of a deal under certain conditions? My S/B computer is FSX only thus not on 24/7. The flaw is that the chipset overvolts the SATA interface. Kind of like what we do when OCing our rigs. Worst case scenario is you won't be able to access your HD / SATA. "For systems with heavier usage patterns, the failure rate during that initial three-year window could be as high as roughly 15%." -Intel Don't sweat it - you will get a replacement MOBO in a few months. jja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TenBlade Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 A good reason to install PCI-E SSD´s Bjorn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumsonly2002 Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 I do not want to make lite of the problem, but it appears to not be that big of a deal, unless one is using a lot of drives etc. The fix... Glad I got my S/B Mother board as now they are hard to get. I use 2 SSD's, DVD and card reader thus how much use will be involved with a card reader and a DVD? Hopefully have it built soon. For those who have Sandy Bridge, IMHO, not to worry. I am not loosing sleep over this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 How will Gigabyte know that I purchased one of their P67 Mobo? Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwho Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 http://gigabytedaily.blogspot.com/2011/02/intel-6-series-chipset-issues-q.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 That guy, Linus I think the name is, has some great technical and practical videos out which even a dummie like me can understand. I think he belongs to a website NCIX or something like that. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiFlyer Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 http://www.informationweek.com/news/hardware/processors/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=229200223&cid=RSSfeed_IWK_All http://newsroom.intel.com/community/intel_newsroom/blog/2011/01/31/intel-identifies-chipset-design-error-implementing-solution Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek McAllan Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 Breaking news! Yesterday... http://orbxsystems.com/forums/index.php?topic=31966.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olafg Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 Wow. How great. I just noticed that my store cancelled the shipment of my motherboard, but still sent out the GPU, CPU and memory. WHAT! The i5 2500k is kinda useless without a 1155 socket mobo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alainneedle1 Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 New chips probably not available until the end of April....bummer... http://www.fudzilla.com/motherboard/item/21763-broken-sandy-bridge-boards-still-selling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spirit Flyer_old Posted February 4, 2011 Author Share Posted February 4, 2011 There is good news, really good news. Ivy Bridge processors will work on the new P67 1155 motherboards. So when hot new performance Ivy bridge CPUs come along, if you already have Sandy Bridge P57, all you have to do is plunk it in, reflash the bios and you are good to go! Indications are that will not be the case with Sandy Bridges 2011 socket lineup. http://www.fudzilla.com/processors/item/21765-ivy-bridge-22nm-works-with-h67-and-p67 Kind regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alainneedle1 Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 You'r right the 2600E will not work with the 1155 socket since the 2011 socket will use DDR3 triple chanel and not double chanel rams.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spirit Flyer_old Posted February 4, 2011 Author Share Posted February 4, 2011 Not only is that good news for Sandy Bridge 1155 socket adopters, but the RAM that works in the dual channel P67 will be the same specs for Ivy Bridge. Ivy Bridge is expected to be a significant jump in performance over Sandy Bridge and may be be brought forward to be available in Q4 of this year. Apparently Intel hopes to create renewed momentum in the 1155 socket set and is rearranging their moves and releases accordingly, perhaps even curtailing other Sandy Bridge releases to build an increase in demand. In other words they are preselling Ivy Bridge already, suggesting that Sandy Bridge part 1 is the stepping stone to get them across the crevice they stumbled into. http://www.fudzilla.com/motherboard/item/21764-ivy-bridge-22nm-has-ddr3-1600-support Kind regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Attwood Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 So my triple channel DDR3 1600 won't be any good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alainneedle1 Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 So my triple channel DDR3 1600 won't be any good? Not with the 1355 socket, you'll be able to use it with the new and game changer socket 2011..... .....Sorry Stephen I cound not resist.......just having a little fun with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 I take it that irrespective of what new Mobo, CPU's or Chipsets are relaesed, Gigabyte, in my case, will still be offering unconditionally to replace P67 Mobo sometime around April/May? Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjjallen Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 I take it that irrespective of what new Mobo, CPU's or Chipsets are relaesed, Gigabyte, in my case, will still be offering unconditionally to replace P67 Mobo sometime around April/May? Dan Rodger dodger. They should be contacting you. I would expect that they will throw in some extras to make up for the replacement hassle. Check their website for details. jja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BiggerBoat Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Well, I was sitting here debating jumping into the Sandy Bridge fray this month but I guess this seals it. No new mobo's until April/May ... bummer. I might as well just wait it out for Ivy Bridge in Q4 or Q1 2012. By then perhaps Flight will be released or at least on the horizon. Until then, it's a steady 20fps for me in Orbx-land Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waco Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 My sentiments exactly BiggerBoat. If I have to wait until April/May, might as well wait for Ivy Bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tailstrike Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 I guess I waited too long to order my new gear. Got word today from my supplier that my MoBo got turned around and sent back, I'll be waiting 2 months as well too. Bit of a bummer, I have the processor and new video card sitting here waiting for action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumsonly2002 Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 I received my motherboard one day before the recall, whew! Going to build the 2600K within the next 2 weeks. Give me some practice in building computers. FSX is an expensive hobby, but still cheaper than flying lessons or renting an air craft. Sad when FSX cost more per year to stay on the bleeding edge than the cost of my used van ..... sigh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjjallen Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Heads-up for all you MSI GD65 owners: "Hey there - I'm the PR Manager from MSI - and wanted to shed some light on your concerns for cross-shipment. We are currently offering a 3-day pre-paid shipping return label and taking care of shipping costs both ways. There is no manufacturer currently offering cross-shipment for this issue, but we are actually looking into a solution to offer one. We have always went above and beyond to add value as to why people to should go with MSI, and our customer service rating (even on the BBB) is much higher than our competition. As for the COST of all these replacements, I assure you Intel is not footing the complete bill. This affected a lot of business on the marketing efforts, PR efforts, etc. for not only us, but all our retail, etail, and channel business. We also learned about this the same day as the rest of the world! I'll keep you guys updated on if we are able to implement cross-shipment. Just shedding a little light for you. Rajiv Kothari PR Manager - MSI USA he later followed up with this: Hey no problem I also have GREAT news - we have implemented a cross-shipping function for our P67 boards. When you fill out the form, you should have an option that you can select and we will contact you once the necessary items are in stock. We're always gonna make sure we hear you guys out.. and for those that use Facebook, you can always share and express your comments there - I handle it so I can get you answers you need right away. http;//www.facebook.com/Msicomputer.US Or just shoot me a PM I'll get you an answer. Thanks guys and hope this resolution works for you all. Rajiv Kothari PR Manager - MSI USA" jja Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spirit Flyer_old Posted February 5, 2011 Author Share Posted February 5, 2011 Hey that's great Jim. I hope the other manufacturers follow the lead and good sense of MSI. Who wants to have their computers shut down for the duration of an exchange? They can't use the return board for the two or three days they have it before they ship out the new board, so why would they need it first? I feel fortunate to have been able to buy the setup I have when I did. It looks good, runs good, and was relatively light on the credit card. Kind regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumsonly2002 Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Hopefully Asus, EVGA etc. will take the same proactive steps. Bad enough a fella has to remove CPU, Motherboard to return it less be without a computer, or paying shipping etc. Hopefully the returns will be a bigger, better mousetrap than the original. that would be a bit of an equalizer. I feel sorry for professional computer builders who have to swap the M/B's, unless they get paid for the effort. A discount coupon towards an IVY Bridge CPU in lew of the time spent doing a swap of the CPU / Motherboard would sweeten the bad taste of the work involved with these issues. I think it is all good, and the outcome positive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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