active True Earth GB South -- a turkey

[Mac6737]

I guess this is a "support request," because I am inviting suggestions.  But for now I am content once more, having just uninstalled TE GBS.

 

I've tried off and on for about 6 months, but "cannot build this to fly," as we say.  With this scenery enabled, the entire platform has been terribly unstable.  Many CTDs, often for no apparent reason at all, but many triggered by accessing almost anything: the map, trying to save a flight, autopilot.  Frame rates vacillating like crazy, from near my target of 30 to less than 10, in the same airspace, and within minutes!  Blurry ground textures, blacked-out scenery squares.  Even missing surf on the Channel coast.  I tried reducing the scenery complexity to "dense," but that had no discernible impact.  Once, it took over 17 minutes to load a scenario in GBS.

 

Booting up this morning after the uninstall was like a breath of fresh air.  Surf back, FPS back to 30 (except around EGLC add-on, where it was in teens, but still acceptable).  And, on the whole, the scenery looked more realistic than with TE GBS.

 

I have one other TE scenery installed, Northern California.  That was rough, too, especially around the Bay Area.  Absent some magic bullet from this forum, I will likely uninstall that, too, and move on.

 

My specs are below.  I would have thought these sufficient, but apparently not.

 

Mac6737

 

i7-8700K, 3.7 GHz

GeForce GTX 1070 Ti

Aorus Z370 5LGA motherboard

16 GB 2 x *GB DDR4-2400

MSI 27" gaming monitor (set at 2560 x 1440)

[Nick Cooper]

Hello,

nothing wrong with your PC specs.

What P3D settings are you using please?

I have flown this scenery for hours without any of the symptoms you describe, so it should be

possible to make it work for you.

 

[Mac6737]

On 8/5/2020 at 12:35 PM, Nick Cooper said:

Hello,

nothing wrong with your PC specs.

What P3D settings are you using please?

I have flown this scenery for hours without any of the symptoms you describe, so it should be

possible to make it work for you.

 

 

Thank you, Nick.

 

Not sure which "P3D settings" you mean, but I guess you mean the display settings.  They are generally as recommended by Orbx manuals. 

Under "General," my monitor display is as stated previously. 

FXAA is ON, and AA is at 2xMSAA.

I am set at Anisotropic 4x and the texture res is on ULTRA.

 I haven't the foggiest what any of those means (except the monitor).

 

My "Options - World" setting are as in the screenshot.

 

I don't believe there are any other settings that would affect performance, and in any case, all the stuff like cloud draw distance and traffic are well west of the maxima.

 

I gotta say, the Channel coast sure looks good without TE GBS.

 

Mac6737 

[carlosqr]

Hello Mac

I hope you don't mind my intervention here but I followed the topic because I was very concerned about Nick replies as I used to have issues with TEGB, and wanted to keep informed

 

If you don't mind trying this:

01.- Change the texture resolution to 1024 (medium)

02.- Set the frames to 30 or a bit lower if preferred

03.-Water resolution to medium

04.- The Bathymetre is not required unless you are going to use a submarine so you can disable that

05.- Shadow quality and distance is also to consider as this affects a lot the performance, try to keep this from mid to low

 

Also, do you have third party airports? This tend to affect a bit too

If you have, search in Orbx folder for the ICAO code of that airport and put the bgls related to the airport (scenery) off, so the third party ones display better/easier

 

Do you have P3D v4 latest version? V4.5 with Hotfix 3?

 

If you yet find issues you might like to try these settings:

 

 

Just be aware that the autogen and scenery draw distance, as set here, cause the not display of many buildings so you might like to play a bit with those settings, increase then and reduce a bit the next two to compensate.

 

Regards,

 

Carlos

 

 

[Mac6737]

On 8/6/2020 at 5:12 PM, carlosqr said:

 

Also, do you have third party airports? This tend to affect a bit too

If you have, search in Orbx folder for the ICAO code of that airport and put the bgls related to the airport (scenery) off, so the third party ones display better/easier

 

Do you have P3D v4 latest version? V4.5 with Hotfix 3?

Thanks. Carlos.

 

I'll try again, probably using the Venema settings.  But please don't hold your breath.  Everything in the South England is looking great.

 

I don't have Hotfix 3 installed.  Don't recall hearing about it, and I'm sure LM never sent me notice.  Is it important?  The description did not seem so, and the instrux for install said you would have to "delete your Client."  I get impatient with tech guys' gibberish.

 

One further Q:  Yes, I have Orbx London City scenery (EGLC), which is terrific (but very dense).  Where do you find the bgls you refer to?  They are not in P3D/scenery.  And you can't be referring to the Orbx ones, because you say the point is to make the add-on display better.

 

Mac6737   

[carlosqr]

Hi Mac

Ok

Try John's settings

If the London City airport you have then there is no need to do anything else

Is only when you have NON Orbx products in the area when some actions are needed

I could not say how important hotfix 3 is, but I prefer to have the most updated version ( just in case)

 

Maybe Nick or someone else could extend on that point

 

Regards,

 

Carlos

[Nick Cooper]

10 hours ago, Mac6737 said:

 I get impatient with tech guys' gibberish.

 

Hello,

have you reinstalled True Earth Great Britain South?

[Christopher Low]

Quote

And, on the whole, the scenery looked more realistic than with TE GBS.

 

You definitely have a serious problem if you think that default (or any landclass for that matter) looks more realistic than TrueEarth. My advice (if you have not already tried it) would be to install TrueEarth GB South using the old scenery.cfg method (in other words, install it in the main P3D folder). I have suffered multiple problems installing scenery via the new addon.xml method, so I avoid it at all costs.

[Mac6737]

On ‎8‎/‎9‎/‎2020 at 3:57 AM, Nick Cooper said:

 

Hello,

have you reinstalled True Earth Great Britain South?

Nick,

 

Yes, I did, and I tried the Venema settings cited in another thread that Carlos referred me to (see above posts).  No improvement at all.  I started from Bournemouth, and at first, it looked OK, plus FPS at my limit (30).  As I approached London, though, FPS slowed to teens; then I lost all sound.  Then CTD!

 

Reloaded P3D; went to Orbx EGLC add-on.  (Load time: 18 minutes!!!)  London looked pretty good, but as I headed south, sound cut out again; on again, off again.  Saved flight and put PC in sleep mode overnight.

 

This morning I reopened the paused flight.  Lost map function in VC, lost sound (this time permanently), blurry textures.  So I saved flight, tried to close sim ("not responding"); forced closure with Task Mgr., and reopened (13:25 load time -- an improvement!).  Loaded saved flight; still no sound, although map was back. Couldn't exit Window mode, couldn't even pause.

 

Forced closure and UNINSTALLED TE GBS. 

 

Sorry, it just is not worth it.  Even when I'm flying along at 30 fps, CTD or some lesser malfunction may occur at any time for no apparent reason at all.  And the, you wait abt least 15 minutes to get going again.

 

Mac6737 

 

[Mac6737]

On ‎8‎/‎8‎/‎2020 at 6:55 PM, carlosqr said:

Hi Mac

Ok

Try John's settings

Carlos

Carlos,

 

please see my lengthy reply to Nick. 

 

I give up.

[carlosqr]

Hi Mac

 

What an odd thing

 

Can you please confirm you also have a folder named TrueEarth Great Britain Libraries within the Orbx library?

Do you happen to have also England and Wales regions?

And would you mind confirming how you have set the insertion points?

 

I also think that the suggested recommendation by Christopher could work.

Xml method sometimes is mess it up

 

Give a final try installing inside the P3D root and ensure the TrueEarth Great Britain Libraries are also installed

 

Is your direct X file updated?

 

I once had an issue with audio when I pause the sim and then run it again I had hald audio, so Tim  recommended me running this:

 

 

The link to MS here:

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=35

 

I hope it fixes your audio issue at least

 

I hope you don't mind trying Christopher's proposal and letting us know if there has been an improvement, so Nick can suggest something additional

 

Regards,

 

Carlos

 

[Nick Cooper]

Hello Mac,

I wonder if there is a problem with your PC, possibly cooling.

To diagnose such things, I use HwInfo, which tells you more

or less everything that is going on in there.

Do make sure that you have not disabled your Windows swap file.

You really shouldn't have the problems that you are having,

although the London area is a challenge for any PC.

You don't need to uninstall TEGB, just untick it, either in the scenery library

or if it is installed as an add-on, in the add-ons menu.

Another thing I do is to disable all the scenery that I'm not using.

If I leave the whole Orbx catalogue installed and active, it does indeed

take a very long time to load.

 

You asked me for my settings, your PC and mine are very similar, now that I have updated mine and it should be able to handle them with ease.

 

 

 

 

This is the first time I have run TEGB on P3D v4 with the new hardware and these shots are typical.

You can see that it isn't really struggling, and nor should yours be.

The V number is a good guide to how well the PC is coping, the lower the number, the better.

These are all 2k shots, uploaded without any editing.

You can click on each image up to three times to enlarge it.

 

Not much scenery here, frame rate unlocked, high frame rate but high V number too.

 

Approaching Leeds Bradford, frame rate unlocked, high V number

 

Similar shot, frame rate locked at 30, see the very low V number

 

Finally, London, frame rate unlocked, high V number but nowhere near a problem.

 

 

[Mac6737]

5 hours ago, Nick Cooper said:

Do make sure that you have not disabled your Windows swap file.

You really shouldn't have the problems that you are having,

 

Nick,

So sorry, but I have NO idea what the Windows "swap file" is, or how I could possibly have disabled it.

 

I agree with your 2d sentence here.  However, i do have those problems, and I've been working with them, off and on, for 6 months.  And it strikes me that what all the help in this thread seems not to get is that the problems I describe in detail arise ONLY in TE GBS!  For instance, I have never had a problem with intermittent sound --not in FS 2.0, FS 4,0, FS 95, FS 98, COF, FSX, P3D -- until TE GBS.  Everything else is running fine -- not flawlessly, but good enough to permit an enjoyable flight experience, day in, day out.  I have never had serial CTDs for no apparent reason with such remarkable regularity.  Maybe there's some weird chemistry between MY installation and this particular software, but I am skeptical that folks on this forum can figure out what it is.  

 

Chris Low says I have a "serious problem, " etc.  OK, here's 2 screenshots: same place,  out of Bournemouth, heading SE for I. of Wight.  TE GBS has more detail (but no rolling surf, I note).  OK, I'll take it.  "Perfection is the enemy of excellence."

 

Mac6737

 

PS -- As noted before, TE No Cal was running kind of rough too.  I reserve judgment on that.   

[Christopher Low]

I guess that beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Landclass scenery (even Orbx stuff) always looks "fake" to me, and (generally speaking) coastlines in TrueEarth are far more accurate than any landclass scenery. As for the "rolling surf", I personally hate that in P3D. It does not look convincing at all to me. However, I understand your frustration regarding this. It's just that TrueEarth GB runs exceptionally well on my PC (which is very similar to yours, apart from the fact that my i5 7600k CPU is overclocked @ 4.6Ghz).

 

With respect to load times, I do agree with Nick regarding disabling scenery areas that are not required for a particular flight. I do that all the time, which is probably why I never have a problem with excessively long waits.

[Nick Cooper]

On 8/12/2020 at 2:50 AM, Mac6737 said:

Nick,

So sorry, but I have NO idea what the Windows "swap file" is, or how I could possibly have disabled it.

I agree with your 2d sentence here.  However, i do have those problems, and I've been working with them, off and on, for 6 months.  And it strikes me that what all the help in this thread seems not to get is that the problems I describe in detail arise ONLY in TE GBS!  For instance, I have never had a problem with intermittent sound --not in FS 2.0, FS 4,0, FS 95, FS 98, COF, FSX, P3D -- until TE GBS.  Everything else is running fine -- not flawlessly, but good enough to permit an enjoyable flight experience, day in, day out.  I have never had serial CTDs for no apparent reason with such remarkable regularity.  Maybe there's some weird chemistry between MY installation and this particular software, but I am skeptical that folks on this forum can figure out what it is. 

 

Hello,

I have made a small error in calling what I meant, page file, swapfile, although Windows 10 has both.

The Windows page file is the means that Windows uses to keep going if it uses up all of the available

hardware RAM on a system.

Here is a link to an explanation of what they do.

 

I have not addressed the quality of the scenery in my reply, but your report of CTDs, loss of sound and episodes like this:

 

Quote

This morning I reopened the paused flight.  Lost map function in VC, lost sound (this time permanently), blurry textures. 

So I saved flight, tried to close sim ("not responding"); forced closure with Task Mgr., and reopened (13:25 load time -- an improvement!). 

Loaded saved flight; still no sound, although map was back.

Couldn't exit Window mode, couldn't even pause.

I am skeptical that folks on this forum can figure out what it is.  

 

are not indicative of a typical problem with TEGB but of a problem with the hardware.

I have shown you evidence to support this and Mr Low has added his own statement

that does the same.

The likelihood is that displaying the TEGB scenery is making your PC work harder than

all the other software that you quote and exposing an underlying weakness.

As I have already written, my first port of call would be HwInfo, to see what is going on

inside your PC and in particular, to monitor its temperatures.

I would agree that faced with your unwillingness to even test the theory, it is indeed

unlikely that we will be able to give effective support.

 

 

 

 

[Mac6737]

9 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

I guess that beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Landclass scenery (even Orbx stuff) always looks "fake" to me, and (generally speaking) coastlines in TrueEarth are far more accurate than any landclass scenery. As for the "rolling surf", I personally hate that in P3D. It does not look convincing at all to me. However, I understand your frustration regarding this. It's just that TrueEarth GB runs exceptionally well on my PC (which is very similar to yours, apart from the fact that my i5 7600k CPU is overclocked @ 4.6Ghz).

 

With respect to load times, I do agree with Nick regarding disabling scenery areas that are not required for a particular flight. I do that all the time, which is probably why I never have a problem with excessively long waits.

Thanks for your understanding. 

I hated the rolling surf in P3D, too, and I even posted an inquiry asking if it could be tweaked.  The answer was even better: Orbx Freeware, "Pacific Northwest Ferries," which replaces the rolling surf world-wide.  Still looks a trifle hokey, but a big improvement, and IMO better than still ocean water. 

As to disabling scenery areas, I'm confused.  Nick says: "You don't need to uninstall TEGB, just untick it, either in the scenery library or if it is installed as an add-on, in the add-ons menu."

Well, you can't access the scenery library unless you load the sim.  Are we saying that you go only as far as the opening screen, then access the scenery library, and untick what you don't intend to use?

 

Mac6737 

 

 

[Mac6737]

9 hours ago, Nick Cooper said:

The likelihood is that displaying the TEGB scenery is making your PC work harder than

all the other software that you quote and exposing an underlying weakness.

As I have already written, my first post of call would be HwInfo, to see what is going on

inside your PC and in particular, to monitor its temperatures.

I would agree that faced with your unwillingness to even test the theory, it is indeed

unlikely that we will be able to give effective support.

Nick,

I never said I was "unwilling to even test the theory."  I pointed out that nobody had addressed the signal fact that my problems arise only in TE GBS.  Well, now you have, and I am certainly willing to try HWiNFO.  So, I went to the link you provided.

Here's a screenshot of the home page.  The option on the left is unavailable to me, because it rejects my email address as invalid. (???!!!)  The one in the middle seems to relate to a Chrome taskbar, and the one on the right relates to pre-Windows DOS, and is no longer supported.

 

So I'm still stuck. 

 

Mac6737

 

[Nick Cooper]

Hello,

that's because you have clicked on the wrong link.

Please go back to the page and click on the bright green Free Download link in the left hand column.

[Mac6737]

7 hours ago, Nick Cooper said:

Hello,

that's because you have clicked on the wrong link.

Please go back to the page and click on the bright green Free Download link in the left hand column.

Well . . .okay, I guess. 

 

But, actually, I also tried that before.  It says it's freeware.  Then it wants my credit card info.  There a million scams out there in cyberspace, and it pays to be paranoid.  However, I generally trust this forum and known characters on it.  R U telling me this is not a scam?  And, if it's freeware, why do they want my credit card?  Also, how do they get rich?

 

Mac6737

[Nick Cooper]

Hello,

this utility is safely used by millions of users and recommended as a diagnostic tool by companies such as Dell, one

of the world's largest manufacturers of computers and an entity that I think most people would trust not to promote

harmful software. The link also includes a useful guide on how to use the utility to diagnose overheating.

You can read that in safety, you do not need to click on any other links.

 

The HWinfo site is clearly funded by advertising, in common with millions of other sites.

I have attempted to replicate your experience and have done so by clicking on one of the other unrelated links,

which clearly states that it is for an entirely different program before requiring an e mail address.

For this reason, here is a brief guide to show you exactly how to navigate this site.

 

If you do decide to go ahead, if you click only on the link that I have highlighted in purple in this image,

 

 

and then only this link, also highlighted in purple:

 

 

you will be taken to this page, where you can click only on the link I have highlighted in purple.

 

Note that if you also distrust installers, you can click on the HWiNFO Portable link instead and download just the files in a zip file.

 

That will download the installer in an exe file.

 

If clicking on either link takes you to somewhere else, then perhaps your internet browser is already compromised.

The utility is freeware and cannot be paid for, although a voluntary donation would be accepted.

 

If you decide that you are unable to follow my suggestion, then I recommend that you conduct your own search for diagnostic

software and use it to check that there is not a hardware problem at the root of your problems with TEGB.

 

 

[Christopher Low]

To be fair to the OP, websites like that seem to do their level best to confuse the user, and get them to download something entirely different from the product that they are looking for.

[Nick Cooper]

Thanks for your input.        

Most helpful.                                                                                                                        

 

 

[Mac6737]

On 8/13/2020 at 12:08 AM, Nick Cooper said:

If you decide that you are unable to follow my suggestion, then I recommend that you conduct your own search for diagnostic

software and use it to check that there is not a hardware problem at the root of your problems with TEGB.

 

Nick,

 

Thanks for your detailed advice.  I'll do it, in due course.

 

Mac6737

[Mac6737]

On 8/13/2020 at 12:08 AM, Nick Cooper said:

If you decide that you are unable to follow my suggestion, then I recommend that you conduct your own search for diagnostic

software and use it to check that there is not a hardware problem at the root of your problems with TEGB.

Nick, 
 

Well, as promised, I did it.  Installed HWiNFO and ran it.  Retrieved the HTML report and studied it.  It goes on forever, most of it undecipherable by liberal arts majors like me.  But I did look for any indications of something amiss -- like an entry in red, or a big red X -- but found nothing.

 

But here's more data and a further Q:

 

-- In prior posts, I also cast aspersions on Orbx TE No Cal, saying it "ran rough."  The other day, I went back to No Cal after changing my display settings to the "Venema setiings" mentioned above.  Wow!  Great improvement.  Smooth as silk all the way from Redding (KRDD) over to the coast and south to the Golden Gate, landing at Concord (KCCR); then off again down the Bay to San Jose.  No CTDs, only a few stutters.  What all this suggests is that my hardware is functioning fine, and turning the res down to 1024 x 1024 makes TrueEarth sceneries functional on my rig.  Except for TE GBS, that is.

 

--  I found a separate thread where someone was having trouble with TE GBS and mentioned he had the England Region installed, and disabled it.  I have England Region, too.  Could that possibly be the problem?

 

Thanks as always,

 

Mac6737        

[Nick Cooper]

Hello Mac,

I had hoped that you would use the Sensor readouts to watch and see

what is happening to your PC while it is trying to display TEGB.

That might have given you an idea why it crashes to the desktop.

[Mac6737]

22 hours ago, Nick Cooper said:

I had hoped that you would use the Sensor readouts to watch and see

what is happening to your PC while it is trying to display TEGB.

That might have given you an idea why it crashes to the desktop.

 

Nick,

 

OK, are you saying I can have HWiNFO running at the same time as the simulator?  I just opened it again and checked the box for "sensor readings."  Am I supposed to leave that window open while I run P3D?

 

Mac6737

 

[Nick Cooper]

Hello,

yes, that would be the idea and there is also a facility to log what happens.

Not wishing to overcomplicate, using the Riva Tuner Statistics Server, you

can have whatever information you wish in an on screen display.

Invaluable for diagnosing problems.

[Mac6737]

On 8/18/2020 at 12:32 PM, Nick Cooper said:

Hello,

yes, that would be the idea and there is also a facility to log what happens.

Not wishing to overcomplicate, using the Riva Tuner Statistics Server, you

can have whatever information you wish in an on screen display.

Invaluable for diagnosing problems.

Nick,

 

Didn't want to leave you hanging.  

I can see nothing amiss in my hardware functioning in HWiNFO, although I admit a more practiced eye might see things that i do not.

 

That said, please consider this matter resolved.  With my res set to Medium (1024 x 1024), TE No Cal has been running smooth as silk (well, pretty much).  I reverted to the old Orbx England region settings, and unticked the TE GBS settings.  As I've said previously, it now looks great and runs fine.  

 

One final oddity: IRL, there's a destroyer escort docked across the Thames from the Tower.  It wasn't there in P3D when I had TE GBS enabled, but now it's there!

 

Mac6737

[Nick Cooper]

The news is here: