Deactivate Orbx Scenery not in use

[stesma54]

Hi everyone...i'd like to know if i can get some advantage in terms of performance by deactivating orbx scenery not in use: for instance...if i'm flying in the U.S.A., is it a good idea disabling England regions and its airports within Scenery Config Editor?

Thanks in advance

stefano smania

 

[Museumkeeper]

Hi

 

Please read.

 

 

Kind regards

 

Ian

[stesma54]

ok thank you...

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[Jon Clarke]

Hi Stephano and welcome to the forums. Technically speaking I cannot answer your question but as a user of a scenery cfg editing programme I can tell you that I use it all the time in exactly the example you have given. Disabling unused scenery seems to be an advantageous idea but as i said "technically" I don't know if it reduces the amount of work the processor has to go through in reading files. What I can say is that loading times are quick, but my sim is on SSD so that will be a reason it loads quickly, but by using the cfg editing programme I have never had an OOM( I use P3Dv3 so again that may be a reason for no OOMs)

 Someone more technically knowledgable wil be able to answer as to whether there are benefits. I can tell you that if you do go that route then make sure that if you have Vector installed then you need to run the AEC tool with a scenery cfg that has ALL your sceneries "Enabled", then when it has done it's corrections you can then use the scenery cfg editing programme. I have really good performance on my sim with not a particularly high spec PC compared to some who have processors running in 4+GB and Titan+ GPUs. I run at 3.5 with a 780, all settings in Ultra except vegetation at Normal, 100% AI & GA traffic etc.

I see no harm in using the cfg editor but as to it's advantage I cannot say due to lack of technical knowledge regarding the Sim programming.

I swear by it, but it's just my preference and maybe a placibo !

[stesma54]

Thank you very much for your answer...and thaks for your tip about Vector. I was afraid to harm FSX but your reply reassured me.

About performance improvement i'm gonna wait some "pc expert" to answer.

thanks again.

stefano

[dominique]

HI Stephano and welcome

The Scenery Library is an index of sceneries the FS knows how to pick up. A road map. Disabling them there is generally not worth the hassle in my experience.  The FS won't load England if you fly the PNW anyway !  Now there are an exception to the rule, it might be useful to disable some airports that  you just overfly and that may induce OOM on your install. You fly  from Seattle to San Francisco, you may want disable the airports in between for instance..  This is true for FSX and P3D V2, P3D V3 seems to have solved the issue of memory bloating, discarding from the memory sceneries which have been passed over in a certain radius.

 

IMHO, it is a really bad idea to manipulate the core files in any other way than with the sim User Interface (the sliders) except if you exactly know what you do, you keep a detailed record of what you do (including saving the original) and have a Windows restore point. The FS in all its flavor is a delicate and fragile ecosystem that you can upset easily.  Blindly tweaking these files is a sure recipe of disaster, at one time or another, the support forum is here as a proof. Doing it with a third party program profiling startups (a launcher), when it has been proven many times over as reliable, is a possibility. P3D V3 made that useless though.

 

 

[Jon Clarke]

Hi Dominique, what do you mean by " Doing it with a third party program profiling startups (a launcher), when it has been proven many times over as reliable, is a possibility. P3D V3 made that useless though. " especially the bit about P3Dv3 made that useless? A reliable programme that has been proven is not really a "blind tweak" is it, especially when all backups are made by the programme. Also if for example you are flying in UK then all your Europe FTX addons will activate including Norway. I agree regarding flying PNW will not load England just as England will not load PNW. However if you have a scenery cfg that only loads England it will not load Wales/Scotland/Ireland/Northern Ireland or Norway as these can be set as disabled. There are many sites which do "suggest" a scenery editior as it can assist in eliminating OOMs as also do programmes that assist in traffic management. All these can only help reduce load on the system and hence reduce the possibilty of OOMs while enjoying maximum performance.  I can attest to that personally. I have never "damaged" my Sim by using proven assitance programmes. The problems that are posted in the support forums are normally based on users not installing correctly like not unwrapping and installing from the zip,or not running the additional sets of installs like orbxlibs or Vector tool, or library inserts, or switching and applying Regions correctly.

 I agree that the scenery editor or equivalent may not be "necessary" but i would not state that it is harmful.

[dominique]

Hi JJC

 

 FSX and P3DV2 accumulate in memory sceneries that they use till they OOM so when you are bound to fly over heavy airports that you do not use, it can be wise to pre-empt and unload them before launching the sim. Honestly, I never do that but it makes sense, I think. The SL is perfectly fit for that.What I understand is that P3DV3, contrary to FSX and P3D v2, unloads sceneries when they are not reasonably needed anymore, I mean within an useful radius, greatly reducing the need for profiling your flight, addons wise.

 

I took the example of PNW/England because that was Stephano was asking (he said USA not PNW, let the record be straight ). Getting back to your example, I do not think that when you fly in Wales or Ireland that Norway is loaded in RAM. A fat region is about what, say 4/5 Gb ?  Multiplying it by  6 ( EN+ NI+SC+WA+IR+NO), you would then exceed the RAM in most of the computers. I fly in Europe with OpenLC, not with fat regions (except Wales). I use fat regions mostly in the US and Oceania . My NA folder is about 50 Gb ! Not everything is obviously loaded in my 16 Gb RAM. The FS loads what it needs, when it needs. FSX and V2 keep them, P3DV3 discards what it does not need after some distance from them. Getting back to our example. NO could very well be loaded if you fly Northern Scotland. But is this a problem ?

 

It is not harmul to use a good proven launcher with a clear UI like SimLauncher X . I just feel it that it is useless . But, of course, this is a question of taste. Editing the scenery/terrain.cfg without knowing what you do, on the other hand, might be harmful and life is too short to hunt errors of a botched editing.

 

This is what I understand, ready to stand corrected ! 

[Bruce Hamilton]

1 hour ago, dominique said:

The FS loads what it needs, when it needs. FSX and V2 keep them, P3DV3 discards what it does not need after some distance from them.

 

The fact that you can leave a frames heavy airport like Seattle and watch your frames increase as you get out of range shows it gets unloaded.  If it didn't, you would OOM within 10 miles out of your departure airport.

[stesma54]

thank you all for your suggestions...so,scenery config editor is pretty useless from what i understand...not harmful but not really useful.

i agree totally with dominique when you say that FSX is a fragile and delicate ecosystem

[dominique]

1 hour ago, Bruce Hamilton said:

 

The fact that you can leave a frames heavy airport like Seattle and watch your frames increase as you get out of range shows it gets unloaded.  If it didn't, you would OOM within 10 miles out of your departure airport.

 

Jerkyness due to heavy computational needs (framerate) and OOM due memory footprint (VAS) are two different things, I think. In your example, your framerate improves because, 10 miles off Seattle, your FS doesn't have to display a complex moving geometry anymore but the Seattle scenery is loaded still in memory in FSX and V2 till the end of yourflight or a rather long time.. I'm no specialist but this is what I understand from the numerous posts on OOM. 

 

 

[Nick Cooper]

48 minutes ago, stesma54 said:

thank you all for your suggestions...so,scenery config editor is pretty useless from what i understand...not harmful but not really useful.

i agree totally with dominique when you say that FSX is a fragile and delicate ecosystem

 

The Scenery Config Editor is probably one of the most powerful and useful tools available to those who have 

large amounts of scenery.

With it, it is possible to create custom scenery.cfg files to suit every kind of flying and allows the easy loading of only

the scenery in the area to be flown over.

It is also possible to create scenery groups which can be switched on or off as required with a few mouse clicks.

While FTX Central does the same for FTX products, they can both be used with a little care and preparation.

 

Careful use of the scenery.cfg editor can massively reduce simulator loading times and virtually eliminate the

occurrence of OOMs.

 

Best of all, it is free and still supported.

It will work with all versions of both FSX and P3D.

[Bruce Hamilton]

21 minutes ago, dominique said:

In your example, your framerate improves because, 10 miles off Seattle, your FS doesn't have to display a complex moving geometry anymore but the Seattle scenery is loaded still in memory in FSX and V2 till the end of yourflight or a rather long time.. I'm no specialist but this is what I understand from the numerous posts on OOM.

 

I've watched some of my previous flights from the outside view, and the airport I took off from will go blurry and disappear between ten and twenty miles out, I presume at that point it is removed from memory or at least written to a cache and cleared from RAM.  It has to load the scenery in front of you, and it only sees four gigabytes of whatever you have, that won't hold a very long flight.  Certain planes at certain airports will OOM within seconds, and I just loaded the simulator... there should be nothing in memory.

[DesertPilot]

10 minutes ago, Nick Cooper said:

 

The Scenery Config Editor is probably one of the most powerful and useful tools available to those who have 

large amounts of scenery.

 

I concur. While I do have the complete collection of Orbx sceneries, I also have many scenery products from other vendors (MegaSceneryEarth, Aerosoft, and others). When I originally had every single scenery listed in a master scenery.cfg file, I kept running into P3D v3 crashes and slower loads. With the help of Scenery Config Editor, I now have separate custom scenery.cfg files for each category (one for ORBX, one for photoscenery, and so on). I use SIMstarter to automatically load the appropriate custom scenery.cfg file based on the selected profile and so on. Works great for me.

[stesma54]

ok,thanks to you posts things are more clear now...basically i have all orbx sceneries of America (all regions with LC and airports) and Europe ( all England regions,its airports) and OpenLc and a dozen of 3rd part developers airports (USA only).Saying that,FTX Central v2 should be enough for me,without using Scenery Config Editor.I'm totally new in this amazing world of flight simulation and sorry for my probably stupid questions.

[Jon Clarke]

Your question was not stupid at all, in fact it opened up a very useful debate on the topic of scenerycfg editors and their potential usefulness. The posts above are testament to that.

I believe that Nick expressed my views but in a far more concise manner !! Dominique many thanks for your explanation in responding to my question to you.

Staphano: As you have a lot od scenery addons, many will not be required to be active/enabled for your flights. I would suggest you try a cfg editor, I use SimStarter, other brands are available, and see if it helps. I would also suggest AirTraffic Manager as an ai traffic tool which will also increase your performance by reducing the number of active flights whatever traffic slider setting you use. A good example of how traffic can influence your system is given by Burkhard the developer of My Traffic who says, as an example, that if you start a flight say in a southeast England region, your sim is also activating traffic around Paris, so you can use a traffic manager to delete those Paris based flights until they become relevant as you enter France, As you enter France the traffic manager will be deleting flights starting at Gatwick/Heathrow/Stanstead and others. All very helpful in assisting system performance without having to comprimise too much like turning ai off so you don't get stutters or possibly OOM.

Good luck !

[FalconAF]

As an aside to all the above, your Scenery.cfg FILE can get "out of order" or experience "formatting errors" even using the latest scenery configuration managers.  The entries in it can get messed up, and you can see this if you open it using Notepad.  It won't always cause you a problem, but sometimes it can.  The entries in the file will get formatted incorrectly, usually for the Scenery LIBRARY entries at the top of the scenery library list in the flight sim (note these entries will be at the BOTTOM of the Scenery.cfg file, as that file shows the Scenery LIBRARY list in reverse order).  It will look horrible, with line spacing gone for several of the top priority entries, the Scenery Area numbers being out of sequence, etc.

 

Every flight simmer should have a very small freeware program called FSTScenery.exe.  Do a Google search for FSTScenery.ZIP and you will find it available at almost all flight sim forums.  Keep a shortcut to it on your desktop, and whenever you use ANYTHING to change something in your Scenery Library, when you finish, run FSTScenery.exe to make SURE your scenery.cfg FILE was re-written correctly.  It will check the formatting of the file and "clean it up" if necessary.   

 

I keep a shortcut to my Scenery.cfg file on my desktop too, just to look at it quickly using Notepad.  Many, many times after activating, deactivating, or using a third-party tool to make changes to the Scenery Library, if I then open the Scenery.cfg file in Notepad and scroll to the BOTTOM of the display (which will be the TOP of your Scenery Library entries in the flightsim), the top few entries will be formatted wrong.  Close the file, then run the FSTScenery.exe program.  It will fix it in less than a second. Then (if you want to) go look at the Scenery.cfg file again.  It will be formatted correctly the way it should be.

 

Why do the above?  If you make any changes to your Scenery LIBRARY, the first thing your flight sim is going to do when you start it is "Rebuilding the Scenery Database".  It will use the Scenery.cfg file to do this.  Save yourself some possible grief.  Make sure it is using a properly "textually" formatted Scenery.cfg file to rebuild the Scenery Library database.  Not one with gaps between the scenery layer numbers, convoluted text entries with improper spacing, etc.

 

 

[stesma54]

ok thank you all !!! About FSTScenery.exe I'll give it a try for sure,but FalconAF i've a question for you: looking at the scenery.cfg how can you recognise the entries that are formatted wrong? I've 295 areas but they look pretty much the same to me...confused

[Nick Cooper]

If you use any of the software recommended in this topic, it

will tell you what is wrong and allow you to correct it.

 

[stesma54]

ok mr cooper, I'll start working on it right awa.thanks again

[FalconAF]

For Stesma54's question to me:

 

Here's is an example of what my "properly formatted" scenery.cfg file would look at if I scrolled to the BOTTOM of the file using Notepad.  Note that I would have to start reading it from the BOTTOM to the TOP for it to be in the same order as what I would see in my FSX Scenery Library display.  And the [Area.xxx] numbers would be the REVERSE of the PRIORITY LAYER numbers in the Scenery Library:

 

------------------------------------------------

[Area.298]
Title=KLSV - Nellis AFB Thunderbird Hanger
Local=KLSV - Nellis AFB Thunderbird Hanger
Layer=298
Active=TRUE
Required=FALSE

 

[Area.299]
Title=KLAS - FS Dream Team
Local=FsDreamTeam\KLAS
Layer=299
Active=TRUE
Required=FALSE

 

[Area.300]
Title=17FL - Greystone X - FS Dream Team
Local=fsdreamteam\GreystoneX
Layer=300
Active=TRUE
Required=FALSE

 

[Area.301]
Title=FSDreamTeam Los Angeles International
Local=FsDreamTeam\KLAX_V2
Layer=301
Active=FALSE
Required=FALSE

 

[Area.302]
Title=AFCADs - Ricks Consolidated DEFAULT AFCAD Folder
Local=C:\Ricks FSX Addons\AFCADs - Ricks Consolidated DEFAULT AFCAD Folder
Layer=302
Active=FALSE
Required=FALSE

-------------------------------------------------

 

Below is what it may end up looking like after activating, deactivating, or (especially) REMOVING something altogether from the Scenery Library, using something OTHER than the Scenery Library when FSX isn't running.  The Area numbers will not be consecutive (like the 299 going to 301 with no 300 between them, or notice Areas 301 and 302 now have DIFFERENT LAYER numbers that don't match their AREA numbers anymore ), the spacing between Areas can disappear, etc.  Basically, the file won't be "formatted" correctly anymore.  Sometimes it won't cause a problem.  Sometimes it will.  So why not start with a properly formatted file to begin with before "Rebuilding the Scenery Database"?  Yes...I know the "Rebuild" of the Scenery Database FSX does is SUPPOSED to always create a good scenery.cfg file during the "rebuild", but trust me...it doesn't always fix it.  And whatever backup it may make could be hosed too if it backed up a corrupted one.  Give it a correct scenery.cfg file to start with by running the FSTScenery.exe application before starting the sim if you made any Scenery Library changes.

----------------------------------------------------

[Area.298]
Title=KLSV - Nellis AFB Thunderbird Hanger
Local=KLSV - Nellis AFB Thunderbird Hanger
Layer=298
Active=TRUE
Required=FALSE

 

[Area.299]
Title=KLAS - FS Dream Team
Local=FsDreamTeam\KLAS
Layer=299
Active=TRUE
Required=FALSE

[Area.301]
Title=FSDreamTeam Los Angeles International
Local=FsDreamTeam\KLAX_V2
Layer=300
Active=FALSE
Required=FALSE

[Area.302]
Title=AFCADs - Ricks Consolidated DEFAULT AFCAD Folder
Local=C:\Ricks FSX Addons\AFCADs - Ricks Consolidated DEFAULT AFCAD Folder
Layer=301
Active=FALSE
Required=FALSE

------------------------------------------------------

 

Hope this helped.

[stesma54]

oh yeah it helped a lot! Now it's perfectly clear. Just checked the scenery.cfg and found out it wasn't properly formatted. launched FSTScenery.exe and it did what it was supposed to do.

thank you again!!!

[FalconAF]

Glad I could help.  I've been flight simming for 3 decades now, and I STILL learn new things about it.  Press on!

 

EDIT:  One thing I should clarify better concerning ending up with a "hosed" backup of your Scenery.cfg file (some people may have already noticed it).  FSX itself won't necessarily save a backup of the Scenery.cfg file when it "Rebuilds" the Scenery Database.  But sometimes it will, or an addon may save a copy when you install the addon.  So here's where you can get caught...

 

1.  You use a third-party scenery library tool to change your Scenery Library, which ends up with you having a "corrupted" Scenery.cfg file because you HAVEN'T started FSX yet to "rebuild" a new one.

 

2.  BEFORE starting FSX, you install an addon that WILL make a backup of the Scenery.cfg file.  Many addons will make that backup so you could go back to the "pre-addon" Scenery.cfg file you had.  But it will be a corrupted backup that got saved.

 

3.  You then run FSX.  It "Rebuilds" a new Scenery.cfg file for you that is formatted properly.  Cool.

 

4.  But...later you decide to uninstall the addon that made a backup of the corrupted Scenery.cfg file.  If that addon replaces your currently "good" file with the corrupted backup it saved, you may end up pulling your hair out trying to figure out what to do to fix things.

 

NEVER make changes to your Scenery Library when FSX is NOT running, then immediately install an ADDON after doing that.  Start FSX FIRST and let it "Rebuid" the Scenery Database and create a non-corrupted new Scenery.cfg file.  Then shut down FSX and install the addon.  Any backup of the Scenery.cfg file the addon makes during it's installation will then be properly formatted in case you have to go back to it. 

 

NOTE:  I've never experienced this issue using FTX Central to change Regions or Global settings.  FTX Central seems to keep everything the way it should be when changing the ORBX products as needed in your Scenery Library.  But you could end up hosing your FSX "overall" making Scenery Library changes with a different Scenery Library utility, followed immediately by adding/removing other addons without running FSX to rebuild the Scenery.cfg file first.  And if you hose your entire FSX installation that way, your ORBX products may not be able to run the way you expect them to run then either.  

 

If in doubt, it's always a good idea to take a look at your Scenery.cfg file using Notepad.  If it's "mis-formatted", run the FSTScenery.exe program to reformat it correctly first. 

[stesma54]

oh my god...you gave me many many super useful advices...i didn't know all this things behind FSX and that's why I sometimes loose my temper at it.

I don't know what to say: thank you very very much for your time and for your patience 

stefano

[FalconAF]

As an aside, the same type of thing can happen to someone's FSX.cfg file, because some addons will make entries in the FSX.cfg file too.  Then remove them if the addon is removed.  When that file gets badly corrupted and the user posts a problem that is hard to decipher, the usual recommendation you'll see in most forums is to "Delete your FSX.cfg file, start FSX, and let it build a new one".  Then when FSX starts it will bring up all those "module" popups asking if you want to "trust this module", etc, etc.  When you say yes, it adds all those addon module entries back into the new FSX.cfg file it's creating.  There's one "Gotcha!" with that process though too.  Any MANUAL changes the user made to the FSX.cfg file (like "tweaks" or adding the WideAspectRatio=True entry) won't get created again.  Then the user wonders what happened when FSX doesn't "look right".  They have to go manually change those entries again, 'cos they aren't there anymore.

 

Don't get paranoid about it all.  Just be aware it can happen.   But it's not a bad idea to make a separate backup of your FSX.cfg file too and keep it in a safe place, especially if you made a lot of manual changes to it and may want a quick way to get a "good" copy of it back into FSX someday.  Resave the backup whenever you add or remove addons in case the addons changed things in the file.  Or use something like the ORBX FSX GO utility to have and use multiple FSX.cfg files for different flying scenarios...you can always have a "default" FSX.cfg file in it that contains any manual changes you may have made yourself.

 

You'll see a lot of developers recommend installing ONE addon at a time, then starting FSX, then shutting it down, then installing the next addon, etc.  The above reasons are why.  

 

But again, I've NEVER had a problem with ORBX addons installing them from scratch one right after another, then starting FSX.  As long as you follow the instructions, FTX Central does a fantastic job of keeping multiple installations of ORBX addons "in sync" with both the Scenery.cfg and FSX.cfg files.  ORBX got it right with FTX Central, as long as you set up the "Insertion Point" in FTX Central correctly.

[stesma54]

You say don't get paranoid...now I'm afraid of even turning my pc on! just kidding...just downloaded SimConfigBackup and made a backup of the most important files. In the afternoon I'll make a system image backup as my FSX is runnin like charm and i agree that never had a problem with ORBX stuff.

I've learned many important things over these days and I wanna thank you again.

cheers!

stefano