rockliffe Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Well, after deliberating for several weeks, today I made the decision, got out my credit card and bought the Thrustmaster Hotas Warthog. I had been considering moving over to a yoke, but I really enjoy using a controller and so I think I have made the right decision. What really clinched the deal was I went to PC world, for nothing else other than to see if they had any yokes in stock, just so I could check them out for real. They had the Saitek yoke, I touched it, turned it and thought, mmm, what a load of blubber! Please, no offense intended to those guys who have this yoke, but I couldn't believe just how plasticky and toyish the whole thing felt. I had thought about the CH yoke, but after reading reviews about the Warthog, talking to guys around here, and the fact that it appears to be the ultimate controller and made of metal, I thought there was no competition. Immersion in FSX along with as much reaslism as possible is extremely important to me and if I sit down every time I want to fly and hold a yoke that feels like a toy, then I am not going to be a happy man. While I realise that both the Saitek and the CH yokes are extremely popular and a lot of guys are very happy with them, that is good, but for me at least, the Warthog will take pride of place in front of my monitor. It is to be delivered next week, so after a few flights I will post my initial impressions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Manhart Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 I'm jealous... My DCS A-10 Sim would love to be matched with one of those! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2110 Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Awesome, I will look forwards to that, cheers Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niebieski Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 What a coincidence! Just two days ago i have ordered Warthog too I'm waiting for Amazon to deliver it to me in the upcoming week! What you say about Saitek yoke is true, it's plastic and it's quality could be better. Nevertheless, i could not imagine flying 737 with stick, even as good as Warthog. I'll keep using with Saitek yoke for airliners and use Warthog for basically everything that doesn't have yoke in the real plane. Can't wait to get Dodo 206 in the air over ORBX with Warthog! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanTenner Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Can't wait to get Dodo 206 in the air over ORBX with Warthog! If the Warthog has such a strong reset force as the Cougar you ll have to train your arm muscles. Then it ll be hard work to fly the Dodo By the way I own the Hotas Cougar and I have to say that it is a whole different feeling to fly with such a quality metal tool. But it is not handy for every aircraft. I ll get a yoke aswell for GA. But I wouldnt change the Cougar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Manhart Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 If the Warthog has such a strong reset force as the Cougar you ll have to train your arm muscles. Then it ll be hard work to fly the Dodo By the way I own the Hotas Cougar and I have to say that it is a whole different feeling to fly with such a quality metal tool. But it is not handy for every aircraft. I ll get a yoke aswell for GA. But I wouldnt change the Cougar This is the primary reason I abandoned the Cougar, too much force required to make the slightest movements, and it made flying a chopper nearly impossible because of the strong centering force. I hope the Warthog has relaxed the tension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 3, 2011 Author Share Posted September 3, 2011 Mmmm, that's interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niebieski Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Phil & Jan, I had the same concern on my mind (strong centering force) but I did some research before i went and purchased Warthog. First, on the other forums i've received answer from guy who own Warthog and flies helis. He said it's very easy to stay in steady hover using small corrections. Secondly, i came up across this video on youtube: [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBMBR8M0z2E It shows an very easy way to remove big spring inside stick and reposition four different smaller springs. Check out the result near the end of video. With this small mod It looks to be perfect for heli flying! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Manhart Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 I wouldn't be worried Howard, from the reviews I've read of the Warthog the centering force is half of the Cougar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virtualwombat Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Best joystick I've ever owned... Cheers, Noel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 3, 2011 Author Share Posted September 3, 2011 I wouldn't be worried Howard, from the reviews I've read of the Warthog the centering force is half of the Cougar. Cool... I am disappointed to be frank Phil. I would like to have got my hands on a proper yoke, but to be honest I can't find anything that is appropriate and made how I would expect one to be made. The closest I've found is the yoke from VR Insight, but unfortunately it does not have any switches or anything at all on the yoke itself. So while that appears to be the most realistic and best made at $500 it lacks what the other cheaper alternatives offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Manhart Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 Cool... I am disappointed to be frank Phil. I wouldn't be disappointed if I had one on it's way to my house, especially after reading this review from SimHQ: http://www.simhq.com/_technology3/technology_174a.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanTenner Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 The centering force is a disadvantage but it is not such a big one. To me the advanteges of the Cougar have way more weight. And if the Warthogs reset force is half that of the Cougar then its no deal to work with it. To be honest there is no problem with most of the aircraft because you dont have to push it all the time. It was hard work in the Jetranger when flying very fast but after I did a flight in a real helicopter I noticed that these are very sensitive and set the Cougar that way. Now I have to push it just a little bit. So no need to be disappointed. If its tghe same quality than the Cougar you will enjoy it every time you just put your hands on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 4, 2011 Author Share Posted September 4, 2011 Thanks guys.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 6, 2011 Author Share Posted September 6, 2011 The Warthog arrived this morning My god, I know I've read about how well constructed it is, but I had no idea... It really is a fantastic looking bit of kit. I will be hooking it up this evening and going for a few test flights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanTenner Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 Great feeling have your hands on kilos of steel, isnt it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niebieski Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 The Warthog arrived this morning Mine too I only had enough time to get it out of the box and ... yeah, it's heavy. I mean really heavy! I can't wait to get back home from work and hook it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 6, 2011 Author Share Posted September 6, 2011 Mine too I only had enough time to get it out of the box and ... yeah, it's heavy. I mean really heavy! I can't wait to get back home from work and hook it up. I'll be interested to hear your thoughts Radek. It's a shame that there isn't a comparable yoke on the market with the same build quality and functionality, for the same price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 6, 2011 Author Share Posted September 6, 2011 Mmmm, unbelievably well made, but sheesh, I've spent the past three hours trying to configure the darn thing with no joy whatsoever. I may well be reading Japanese! Can anyone offer a little advice about allocating the functions. I don't get it. Also how do you configure the hatswitch / POV switch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanTenner Posted September 6, 2011 Share Posted September 6, 2011 There is one little advice I can give you. I got to know it just today. I got my registered copy of FSUIPC and switched off the controller in the FSX-settings. After I configured the axes in FSUIPC I was stunned at how accurate the Cougar is. You should give a try. It is a whole different feeling course I can set all like I want. This is nearly impossible in the FSX-settings. Those are not nearly that accurate and comfortable. Howard, if you have FSUIPC I would also try to configure the switches there. The CH-software is nearly a science. It is very mighty but therefore not that easy to handle. I would stick to configure it in the game you play and only if you miss the extra switches/function try to figure out how that software works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlennH Posted September 7, 2011 Share Posted September 7, 2011 Well, after deliberating for several weeks, today I made the decision, got out my credit card and bought the Thrustmaster Hotas Warthog. I had been considering moving over to a yoke, but I really enjoy using a controller and so I think I have made the right decision. What really clinched the deal was I went to PC world, for nothing else other than to see if they had any yokes in stock, just so I could check them out for real. They had the Saitek yoke, I touched it, turned it and thought, mmm, what a load of blubber! Please, no offense intended to those guys who have this yoke, but I couldn't believe just how plasticky and toyish the whole thing felt. I had thought about the CH yoke, but after reading reviews about the Warthog, talking to guys around here, and the fact that it appears to be the ultimate controller and made of metal, I thought there was no competition. Immersion in FSX along with as much reaslism as possible is extremely important to me and if I sit down every time I want to fly and hold a yoke that feels like a toy, then I am not going to be a happy man. While I realise that both the Saitek and the CH yokes are extremely popular and a lot of guys are very happy with them, that is good, but for me at least, the Warthog will take pride of place in front of my monitor. It is to be delivered next week, so after a few flights I will post my initial impressions. If you thought the Saitek was 'plasticy' and cheap feeling, god knows what you would have thought about the CH yoke. I have owned both and the Saitek easily wins in the 'solid feel' department. As for more 'pro' yokes, these guys are great and have been around for a long time. I have had the pleasure of using the Beech style yoke before and would buy one in a flash if I had the spare cash! https://flypfc.com/?/products/yokes/cirrus-beech-yoke/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanTenner Posted September 7, 2011 Share Posted September 7, 2011 I have thougt about the Flypfc-yokes. It would be great getting one. The price looks good. But shipping to Europe doubles the price and that is not worth it (to me). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 7, 2011 Author Share Posted September 7, 2011 I was also looking at the PFC yokes, they look very good, but as always the price is restrictive. Today I hooked up the Warthog and manged to get some assignments sorted, then found that, as Phil said earlier, it is a very 'heavy' controller, even in the axis sense. I followed the tips in the video that was posted earlier and removed the big spring. It has improved it no end, even now it's twice as 'weighty' as the X52 PRO. I just feel a bit miffed at spending all my dosh and then having to take the things to bits and remove one of the components! It's taking some getting used to, at first I thought, sheesh, maybe I should have gone for the yoke, but then when I feel the workmanship that has gone into this thing, I can't help but think that, for me, would be a backward move to get a yoke. I somehow like using a joystick, I know some will say it's not very realistic, but IMO it feels more realistic than having my hands around a plastic yoke! Please, though fellas, no offense intended for those of you with the Saitek or CH yokes. The other thing that made it difficult to choose was all the contradictory information I would read. Some guy would rave about the CH yoke and then another say how bad it was and how the Saitek was far superior. This was not my experience when I went to see the Saitek yoke in the 'flesh.' As for the Warthog, every single review or comment I've read was positive, with rave reviews across the forums. So yes, it's not a yoke, but when you put your hands around it's little neck, you feel the metal design and the beautifully smooth throttle and everything else seems to blend into insignificance. I wish there was an equivalent yoke made to the same standards and a similar price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 7, 2011 Author Share Posted September 7, 2011 Fellas, can anyone tell me whether using the Saitek rudder pedals will be OK with the Warthog. I assume there won't be any compatibility problems but thought I'd ask all the same... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanTenner Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Should be no problem because the Pedals are recogniced as controller itself. So everywhere you can use multiple controllers there should be no problem at all. It would be tricky if you only can set one controller but nowadays software can handle more than one. Could be a problem with real old games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niebieski Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Howard, i'm using Warthog with Saitek rudder pedals and they work together nicely. Like you, i would pay same price for a decent, solid metal yoke... As for my initial Warthog experience: i've spent most of the time in TARGET Script Editor learning and wrote my first script (for Dodo 206). It's a very powerful tool. Did some flights with Dodo 206 and Aerosoft Huey and it's surely a big step forward from my (not so bad) Logitech Freedom. Centering force mentioned before is not a problem at all. It's great stick for heli flying and i i'm yet to try it in a fixed wing aircraft like A2A Cub / P-47 / Spitfire, Aerosoft Katana / Dimona and Classics Hangar's BF-109, as well as other standalone simulators (DCS BlackShark, Rise of Flight etc.). Throttle switches should make my PMDG 737 flying a lot easier when scripted properly for different cockpit switches like APU, fuel cutoff switches, autobrakes etc. I'll be surely spending more time with Warthog and it's software during the upcoming weekend... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 9, 2011 Author Share Posted September 9, 2011 Howard, i'm using Warthog with Saitek rudder pedals and they work together nicely. Like you, i would pay same price for a decent, solid metal yoke... As for my initial Warthog experience: i've spent most of the time in TARGET Script Editor learning and wrote my first script (for Dodo 206). It's a very powerful tool. Did some flights with Dodo 206 and Aerosoft Huey and it's surely a big step forward from my (not so bad) Logitech Freedom. Centering force mentioned before is not a problem at all. It's great stick for heli flying and i i'm yet to try it in a fixed wing aircraft like A2A Cub / P-47 / Spitfire, Aerosoft Katana / Dimona and Classics Hangar's BF-109, as well as other standalone simulators (DCS BlackShark, Rise of Flight etc.). Throttle switches should make my PMDG 737 flying a lot easier when scripted properly for different cockpit switches like APU, fuel cutoff switches, autobrakes etc. I'll be surely spending more time with Warthog and it's software during the upcoming weekend... Hi Radek, I have once again done the dirty deed and ordered the Saitek Pro lfight pedals, they are the all metal ones from what I undersatnd (fighter pedals?) Anyway, I will have them soon and then I can complete my new sim pit, well it's a separate area in my office , so maybe not a sim pit in the true sense but a place I can have a dedicated monitor and have all my kit permanently installed. I managed some flying yesterday, albeit for a short time, but now I have removed the large tension spring in the controller it handles beautifully! I really love the quality of this hog, to get hold of a wonderfully crafted alloy grip instead of somehting that's made out of plastic, is alone IMO reason enough to buy the kit. I love the smoothness and accuracy of this thing and the movement in the throttle, mmmmm, it is simple complete indulgence!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waco Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 Hi guys. I am considering getting the Warthog also and was wondering how you guys are getting along with it. The only thing holding me back is the price so I guess I need a little push. Do you feel it's worth the money and is it working well for you with GA and helicopters? I've already gone through the CH and Saitek yokes and I'm tired of cheap joysticks. Would appreciate your latest thoughts and experience with the Warthog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 11, 2011 Author Share Posted September 11, 2011 Hi guys. I am considering getting the Warthog also and was wondering how you guys are getting along with it. The only thing holding me back is the price so I guess I need a little push. Do you feel it's worth the money and is it working well for you with GA and helicopters? I've already gone through the CH and Saitek yokes and I'm tired of cheap joysticks. Would appreciate your latest thoughts and experience with the Warthog. All I can say Jimmy, is that when I opened the box and held the thing in my hands, I had a smile that stretched from one side of the room to another. It is simply mmmmmm. It's worth getting hold of simply to move the throttle! It feels like silk. Anyway, all I can say is 9.5 out of 10 and I would thoroughly recommend it. If the software was not so difficult to understand I would give it 10 out of 10! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deverette Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 All I can say Jimmy, is that when I opened the box and held the thing in my hands, I had a smile that stretched from one side of the room to another. It is simply mmmmmm. It's worth getting hold of simply to move the throttle! It feels like silk. Anyway, all I can say is 9.5 out of 10 and I would thoroughly recommend it. If the software was not so difficult to understand I would give it 10 out of 10! I picked up the Thrustmaster Warthog one evening after too many glasses of wine. Best alcohol induced purchase I've made (much better than the blender that showed up from Amazon.com one day out of the blue... I think I was drinking margaritas and thought "I need a new blender"), anyway... The programming software is definitely complex, however I only use it when playing DCS A-10. If you have a registered version of FSUIPC, I HIGHLY recommend doing all your assignments in there. If you enable the profile mode in FSUIPC, it makes things incredibly easy. For hardware I have: Saitek Yoke w/ 2 Throttle Quadrants (6 levers) Saitek Rudder Pedals Thrustmaster Warthog In FSUIPC I have the following profiles setup: Jet, Props, Helo, Fighter Each profile has each control setup. For instance the 6 levers on the throttle quadrants will change function (from throttle 1-4 on jets) to 1-2 throttle, 1-2 prop, 1-2 mixture on props. This way, I install a new aircraft, open FSUIPC and assign it to the specific profile, and everything is mapped. The true joy with this setup is that I can land my C210 somewhere, decide I want to switch to a helicopter and all I have to do is load the new aircraft. FSUIPC does all the control configuring for me, no having to load a different control profile with external software. On a side note, the mechanical switches on the throttle quadrant of the Warthog are really cool. Hope you enjoy the control! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waco Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 The old credit card does not come out easily but I went ahead and made the purchase this afternoon. Looking forward to receiving it. Thanks Howard and Dan for the push. I have the paid version of FSUIPC so I'll go that way to set it up. I'll holler if I need some help. Thanks again Howard. I know you started this post and I've been following it with great interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 12, 2011 Author Share Posted September 12, 2011 The old credit card does not come out easily but I went ahead and made the purchase this afternoon. Looking forward to receiving it. Thanks Howard and Dan for the push. I have the paid version of FSUIPC so I'll go that way to set it up. I'll holler if I need some help. Thanks again Howard. I know you started this post and I've been following it with great interest. Hey Jimmy, let us all know how you get on with it. Good luck... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waco Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 The box has arrived! Wow, this thing is built! Makes everything else look like a toy. Don't think I'll have to buy a new controller for the rest of my life. Have a few questions before I get started. Do you recommend installation of the software? Not sure if it includes a driver or not. I'm going to make my assignments through FSUIPC. How do you enable profiles in FSUIPC? Did you guys remove the big spring? Centering force doesn't seem to be too bad but I haven't used it yet. I fly GA and choppers. Would greatly appreciate your suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockliffe Posted September 15, 2011 Author Share Posted September 15, 2011 Hi Jimmy, glad you like it. It really makes sticking with a stick and not a plasticky yoke pretty worthwhile IMO! I have to say that at the moment, I have only had time for a few short local flights, as I have been building a flight sim area in the corner of the room and so have not spent a great deall of time with the software. However, I did initially install the software. I have to admit I have not got my head around it at the moment. What I want to do is create profiles for each aircraft as I don't have FSUIPC, maybe I should consider getting that. As for the big spring, mmm, sure, I had one flight, disconnected the controller and got rid of it!! It felt OK out of the box, but once I started flying with it, I found it was simply too brutish. The controller is far better now. I had the Saitek X52 pro previously and I found that to be a joke. Even without the spring the Warthog is still twice as stiff and far more accurate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deverette Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Normally you can use FSUIPC to just do straight assignments, and it defaults that you can have set assignments for each specific aircraft (i.e. if you have 5 liveries of a particular airplane, FSUIPC will treat them as 5 different aircraft with regards to aircraft specific profiles). However, I personally find it useful to just have aircraft "type" profiles, rather than a separate profile for each aircraft/livery. For instance I have Jets, Props, SingleProps profiles which, while the button assignments generally stay the same, the controller axes change based on profile. So I can hop from my Baron (with 2 Throttles/Prop/Mixture) to a 747 (with a spoiler axis and 4 throttle axes) with the only change I need to make is swapping the top of the levers on my Saitek throttle quadrants. It's fairly simple to setup. However, if you DO use the "AIRCRAFT SPECIFIC" profile feature of FSUIPC, you cannot use the profile specific as from what I gather, they are mutually exclusive. Just follow these steps: 1 - Backup your FSUIPC.ini file (in your FSX/Modules folder). 2 - Open your FSUIPC.ini file (in notepad) and change the line: UseProfiles=No to UseProfiles=Yes Save the file. 3 - Plug in your flight controllers if they aren't already. 4 - Fire up FSX and load a flight on the ground. 5 - Open FSUIPC and go to the Axis Assignment tab. You should see this: If it says Aircraft Specific instead of Profile Specific (above) you didn't correctly edit/save your FSUIPC.ini file in step 2. 6 - Tick the box to the right of Profile Specifc, and you'll be prompted to apply general assignments: 7 - Select "No". You'll then be able to create your first profile. Select "New": 8 - You'll be prompted to enter a name for your new profile. Let's say you're going to set up a profile you'll use for all your prop driven planes. So, let's call it "Props": 9 - Your UI should now look like this: 10 - From here, assign your axes like you normally would in FSUIPC. 11 - Do the same thing under the Buttons + Switches tab, ensuring you tick the Profile specific box. Note that the profiles are linked. You cannot mix/match. For example you can't have your axes linked to one profile and buttons linked to another profile. 12 - Repeat steps 6-11 for each profile you want to create. Then next time you install a new plane/livery, simply select the profile you want to assign to it: ----------------------------- Note 1: That if you accidentely assign the incorrect profile to an aircraft (i.e. you accidently assign your C185 to your Jets profile), fixing it is easy. Simply open your FSUIPC.ini file, locate the section: [Profile.xxxx] where "xxxx" is the name of the profile you accidently assigned it, remove the last numbered entry (which should be the name of the aircraft you currently have loaded in FS that you accidently assigned), save/close the file. Click the "Reload all assignments" button in FSUIPC and it should allow you to re-assign the aircraft. This is alow the process to remove a profile assignment from an aircraft. Note 2: If you are going to assign your axes this way in FSX, you NEED to disable your controllers in FSX (or remove all the axis assignments in FSX). Personally I find managing all my controllers through FSUIPC is much smoother and easier. If you have any questions, ask. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waco Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Thank you very much for that Dan! Perfectly clear and I appreciate your time in writing it up. I've been using Aircraft Specific but I like the Profiles way better. I'm going to give it a go. I've installed the driver and software. I'm going to use FSUIPC for the assignments though. I removed the big spring but found the stick was a little loose with just the small springs so I've added a couple of washers. The joystick movement seems just about perfect now. I really love this joystick. The movements are so smooth it's improved my flying ten fold. I knew I wasn't that bad of a pilot. Thanks again Dan and Howard for your help. Very very much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanTenner Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Also it feels to me that with FSUIPC the Axes respond much better as with the assignment in FSX. When I used it the first time I felt like having much more control even over aircraft I havent been able to get a good setting without FSUIPC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jadeguy Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 I had given up on my old MS force feedback 2 because FF in FSX is very lame. But then I read Bill Womack mentioning a great utility called Fs Force 2 and although not too cheap it is worth every penny. Fantastic- now I can never go back to a spring tensioned device. Lovely for choppers too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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