--- Posted August 14, 2008 Author Share Posted August 14, 2008 Heiko, John, thanx for your patience. I'm really trying my best to get the best out of MEL !!!! 2 Questions; 1: I thought XP can't address more than 3GB RAM 2: Do you think that switching to vista would make things better? with or without 2 more GB of RAM? Thanx Bernt BTW on my Asus P5K there is no (more) option to check the PCI slot set to 16x etc.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Henare Posted August 14, 2008 Share Posted August 14, 2008 Just be careful in comparing VHHH with YMML, YMML's gmax poly covers a much much greater area as the airport is much much bigger. VHHH ground poly also has a very small texture set compared to YMML as it uses synthetic ground textures so the entire ground poly is painted with probably 5 or 6 texture maps. YMML's photoreal poly uses over 100 texture maps. The like YMML the remainder of the city is covered by resampled photoreal but of much lower resolution. Basically with VHHH they can get away with alot more texture repitition with all the city buildings so can use a much more efficient texture process. YMML is more complex due to the huge variations in architectual design. Just look at the variations between the 5 concourses. Each one is different from the other. Every effort has been made to try to keep the texture count down but to create an honest and accurate model the resolution of the terminals would be very very low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--- Posted August 14, 2008 Author Share Posted August 14, 2008 >YMML's gmax poly covers a much much greater area as the airport is much much bigger But VHHH doesn't consist of only an airport but a whole city!!! However, I'm just leaving to buy 2 more GB of RAM (DDR2-800)......will let you know asap if that helps..... Regards Bernt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Venema Posted August 14, 2008 Share Posted August 14, 2008 OK enough about VHHH ok? If you really want to compare the two airports, just visit the texture folder of VHHH and then the texture folder of YMML. Count the filesizes of both folders. Then visit the scenery folder of both and total the sizes of the bgl files. I'll let you do the maths. As for the "whole city", they use the same 100 apartment block textures repeated about 50 times each, and they are on models with 5 polygons each; versus one of our concourses which has 2,000 polygons alone. We really don't want to keep discussing why VHHH has better FPS because we know why - it's made using a tiny fraction of the model polygons and textures ok? If we made YMML in the same way it would get 100FPS, but it would not look like the real thing. Case closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brendanstacey Posted August 14, 2008 Share Posted August 14, 2008 Maybe you should edit the sticky about YMML performance with the explaination comparing YMML and VHHH? I cant remember whether you have already adreesed this issue on that post but you should make that statement you just made alot more prominent - I think this is all down to a case of misunderstanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--- Posted August 14, 2008 Author Share Posted August 14, 2008 >We really don't want to keep discussing why VHHH has better FPS because we know why - >it's made using a tiny fraction of the model polygons and textures ok? >If we made YMML in the same way it would get 100FPS, but it would not look like the real thing. Now that's a statement. You're really convinced that flytampas VHHH doesn't look like the real thing??? Well, at least these guys did find a superb balance between good performance and a realistic look. BTW I didn't restart the VHHH comparison. I thought in computer programing one is proud if he uses as little data as possible, not the opposite ;-) Your promotional video SHOULDN'T have the problems I mentioned because all the scenes are within the airport boundary. Nevertheless, to my big surprise, starting at 1min 10sec the buildings to the left are initially completely untextured........!!!!!!! BTW, I upgraded to 4GB of RAM, XP recognises 3.25GB as expected, the black tiles and white airport problem is exactly the same. Instead of this completely useless comparison I would prefer to find the bottleneck with Heikos help maybe? Regards Bernt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Venema Posted August 14, 2008 Share Posted August 14, 2008 Instead of this completely useless comparison .... Bernt, by all means continue to work with us to solve your issue, but please, try to be polite about it. We're here to help you, not aggrevate the situation. If you feel that a video made from my laptop is a "completely useless comparison", I am more than happy to defer to others to continue to work with you. As for VHHH, that subject is closed, I'm over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--- Posted August 14, 2008 Author Share Posted August 14, 2008 Ups, slight misunderstanding here apparently. It's NOT the video that is useless! (I don't see where the comparison would be in this video???) In fact it's good, it's the ongoing discussion about VHHH/YMML which was put to rest 7 messages before someone brought it up again, which is useless. Agreed, no more VHHH but how about the texture loading problem on your video and any other ideas than increasing the RAM to 4GB? I even uninstalled AU blue now for troubleshooting, still no change.... Regards Bernt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heiko Glatthorn Posted August 15, 2008 Share Posted August 15, 2008 Did you check if your PCI slot runs at 16X ? Could you download this file http://www.overclock.net/downloads/138140-super-pi.html and run the 1M ? For comparison - i get 12.3 seconds. Which nVidia driver do you use ? Are you using FSX DX9 or DX10 ? Also get GPU-Z here : http://majorgeeks.com/GPU-Z_d5796.html Look at the value under BUS Interface. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--- Posted August 15, 2008 Author Share Posted August 15, 2008 Good morning Heiko, Thanx for the links... ) super pi 1M > 16.2sec DX9 175.19 16x PCI-E (On the Asus P5K there's a dedicated PCI-E 16x slot) The CPU FSB is at 1333 and the GPU shader at 1188. (Back to) 2GB Super Talent DDR2-800 RAM CL5 (as most websites and especially the Asus P5K manual specifically mentions to stay below 3GB RAM with 32bit OS.) What's strange that at even in Johns demo video the texture loading problem occurs.... Regards Bernt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heiko Glatthorn Posted August 15, 2008 Share Posted August 15, 2008 Guten Morgen Bernt, that looks all fine to me. 16 seconds is FSX approved... Does GPU-Z say PCI-E 16x @ 16x ? 'mentions to stay below 3GB RAM with 32bit OS'... For XP ? For Vista this statement is just horse dung, no kidding. Regarding the driver, i was reading a lot about 175.19 isn't cutting it. I used 175.16 and changed to a beta one which works quiet well. I'll let you know which one exactly when i am back home (not that i mix up numbers...). Otherwise i am out of ideas and my conclusion would be dropping the OS for Vista 64 SP1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heiko Glatthorn Posted August 15, 2008 Share Posted August 15, 2008 Btw - what is you RAM setting in the BIOS ? Auto or the manufacturer stated settings (found on the sticker applied to the RAM) ? You can download CPUZ here : http://www.cpuid.com/cpuz.php It's the same like GPU-Z but for the CPU, mainboard and RAM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--- Posted August 16, 2008 Author Share Posted August 16, 2008 Einen schönen Samstag morgen Heiko ) Greetings from YYZ. >Does GPU-Z say PCI-E 16x @ 16x ? Yes. RAM setting is in auto (I'd say almost everything in the BIOS is in auto) Well, switching to vista 64 is an (expensive) option, but considering that every program and every FSX addon runs perfect on my PC I don't know if this is a good idea. Is everyone in your team using vista 64? Are you sure that FSX runs better under vista? LG Bernt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LBPN Posted August 16, 2008 Share Posted August 16, 2008 @bstolle. I can assure you FSX runs better in Vista(32 and 64). With Vista 64 you have the luck that your system will make full use of 4Gb RAM or even more. Vista 32 SP1 only states that you have 4Gb, in reality though it uses only 3.5Gb. For YMML things doesn't change. That's a problem of YMML.It kills most of the high end PC's on this date, no matter the OS. I hope that Orbx will improve YMML, by adding also an options to decrease the no of polygons for those who're not necessarily looking for the real thing and care more about FPS and gameplay smoothness. Until then, your only options are, either you run it with its known issues, or you just unsinstall it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Henare Posted August 16, 2008 Share Posted August 16, 2008 It kills most of the high end PC's on this date, no matter the OS This is not a fair statement, when there are many users with various systems that are very happy with YMML and its performance. To be honest i feel quite disheartened. What can i do if it runs well on my medium spec system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heiko Glatthorn Posted August 16, 2008 Share Posted August 16, 2008 Einen schönen Samstag morgen Heiko ) Greetings from YYZ. >Does GPU-Z say PCI-E 16x @ 16x ? Yes. RAM setting is in auto (I'd say almost everything in the BIOS is in auto) Well, switching to vista 64 is an (expensive) option, but considering that every program and every FSX addon runs perfect on my PC I don't know if this is a good idea. Is everyone in your team using vista 64? Are you sure that FSX runs better under vista? LG Bernt Hehehe greetings from VTBT Well, RAM on auto settings mostly doesn't run at best performance because it uses very loose timings. I would recommend to set it manual - the sticker on your sticks is telling the truth. With Vista 64 you won't achieve higher FPS - FSX is still a 32 bit application. But... it handles memory and virtual memory much better (and many other things like for example multitasking). I can't tell if or how much your system would benefit, but i know that mine runs very well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heiko Glatthorn Posted August 16, 2008 Share Posted August 16, 2008 The post from ftxthebest made me just go make some pics... (i think i post those also in the other topic). The only 'tweak' i have done, was to reduce autogen to normal. MTX is at 40%. Resolution 1920x1200 plus secondary monitor at 1280x1024. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Ross Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 To be honest i feel quite disheartened. Don't be Marty just look at the screen grabs of Mango and be proud of getting that level of realism into FSX. If you want to please all of the people all of the time you are in the wrong business because it will just never happen. It is even more unfair because I know the lengths you have gone to to try to optimise all the modelling work in terms of LOD and vertices. If you feel so inclined I suppose a high performance version could be fairly easily released with some of the detail stripped away although this does seem a retrograde step to me. Well done Marty Regards John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Henare Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 Thanks John, I just reconfirmed my confidence in my work with a nice flight from YSSY and ILS Approach to 16. Settings at Scenery Extreme Dense, Autogen Normal, Frames set to Unlimited. FPS on the whole flight. Had a 25 out of YSSY (Default), upto 60 in cruise, 20-30 on descent through Clouds, and 13-18 all the way down on finals, 15-18 after touch down all the way to the gate. No texture lag, some blurries of the 15cm due to my limited Dual core 2.4 Ghz, 4 GB Ram and Nvidia 8600 GTX with 256, but that is the case with any 15cm i have. No stutters, a nice a smooth flight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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