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Finished with FS2020, Orbx for other Flightsims?


Lionhart27
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I have a dream PC for FS2020, i9-11900K, 32GB Ram, RTX3090, Gen4 MP600 Pro 2TB SSD, Ultrafast Fibre BB, and recent update to Win 11.  The PC runs fast on Win 11 and ALL other Apps, Sims and Games including AeroFly FS2. I did like FS2020 and for short periods it was superb, BUT I could never complete a flight before it CTD. This has been going on now for over 6 months, and it is time to quit with FS2020 and all Orbx FS2020 scenery add-ons.  Over this time FS2020 support has still NOT resolved what the problem is with the continued CTDs, despite the huge amounts of effort on my part to resolve it.  So I have decided to remove FS2020 from my PC and continue with AreoFly FS2 monitor mode  and AeroFly VR which runs superb, crisp and clear.   However the scenery in AeroFly is not that great.  Does Orbx  have scenery for AeroFly?   Or can anyone recommend another Flightsim?  

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Even the best PC can cause CTDs when running MSFS if you don't have all your settings correct or or test mods in the community folder. The only time I had ctds with MSFS was with faulty moods. It's worth the time because there's nothing in the future that will replace MSFS.

 

Read this: https://flightsimulator.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/360016142680-All-versions-How-to-improve-the-performance

 

You can also try XP11 or XP12 when it's released. But even with Orbx TE and all my amazing add-ons, the scenery & airports look outdated.

 

I do not have AeroFly, but I know that there are some sceneries available for the platform.

 

If I were you, I would go back to Win 10 (full clean install) and re-install MSFS, then spend the remainder of 2022 learning the platform. There's so much to learn that if you love flight sim like I do, you will feel a sense of accomplishment. It's an amazing creation!

 

I'm still on a i72600K and I'm enjoying MSFS more than I have ever enjoyed any sim since Flight Unlimited 1/2/3.

 

Maybe this year I'll upgrade to the latest CPU. Maybe!

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Hi Lionhart,

 

I'm very surprised you are having constant issues with MSFS 2020, I've found it to be the most stable sim I've ever used since FS2002, and the only CTDs I've had are faulty mods and not updated scenery to which I've not had a CTD now since December, now this doesn't help you...

 

From you mentioning scenery, I guess it's important to you? The issue is, no other sim comes close to MSFS out of the box, and personally I don't think you can get P3D or XPL to anywhere close to MSFS, no matter how much you spend/tweak etc, but personally I'd go with XPL 11/12 if you want a new sim, I was going to invest in XPL until the sole dev I was going over for announced development for MSFS and going forward I think you'll see more add-on content for XPL over P3D,

 

Regards

Joe

 

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Check Nvidia latest driver ! 

I Installed Version 511.65 and i never finished a flight !

 

Reinstalled 472.84 and No More CTD'S !

 

My msfs2020 runs smooth :) The best sim i ever tried !!!

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Maybe another tip; be sure you have not overclocked the CPU and/or GPU. That could be the culprit too since MSFS is very demanding and possibly overloading the overclocked processors. I had that with my jump from P3D v4 to v5.

 

 

Edited by bvdboomen
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7 hours ago, Lionhart27 said:

I have a dream PC for FS2020, i9-11900K, 32GB Ram, RTX3090, Gen4 MP600 Pro 2TB SSD, Ultrafast Fibre BB, and recent update to Win 11.  The PC runs fast on Win 11 and ALL other Apps, Sims and Games including AeroFly FS2. I did like FS2020 and for short periods it was superb, BUT I could never complete a flight before it CTD. This has been going on now for over 6 months, and it is time to quit with FS2020 and all Orbx FS2020 scenery add-ons.  Over this time FS2020 support has still NOT resolved what the problem is with the continued CTDs, despite the huge amounts of effort on my part to resolve it.  So I have decided to remove FS2020 from my PC and continue with AreoFly FS2 monitor mode  and AeroFly VR which runs superb, crisp and clear.   However the scenery in AeroFly is not that great.  Does Orbx  have scenery for AeroFly?   Or can anyone recommend another Flightsim?  

https://orbxdirect.com/category/europe/afs2?sort=name

 

https://orbxdirect.com/category/north-america/afs2

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My PC spec is very similar to yours, I have a 3090, but instead of an i9, I have an i7-11700K, and 64GB of 3200 DDR4, and MSFS runs superbly in Ultra. I strongly believe it is forces other than your PC at work here. As JoseCFII said, it could well be something in your Community Folder. Have you tried renaming it, and running MSFS in its vanilla state?

I truly think this is an outstanding sim that is only getting better.

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Add-ons, as in freeware normally, are the most likely cause of the CTDs.  Excessive overclocking is also a candidate.

 

The vanilla factory fresh MSFS has proven to be ultra stable and should run at Ultra settings on your computer all day every day.

 

Something isn't right, but whatever it is, it isn't MSFS itself.  AFS2 is a nice smooth sim sure, but MSFS can be just about as smooth and offer the world at your fingertips.

 

I'd be looking for a solution myself.

 

 

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16 hours ago, John Dow said:

Add-ons, as in freeware normally, are the most likely cause of the CTDs.  

I can second that. When I (very rarely) had CTDs it was always faulty or incompatible add-ons. (Aside one in-between MSFS version which was hotfixed within short time).

 

I have all addons (including those by Orbx & friends) organized with the free Addon Linker. This way I can isolate faulty add-ons using a nesting procedure. It's a bit nasty (took an hour each) but always worked so far at the end.

 

And btw., faulty addons can bring other sims to CTD as well. Believe me.

 

Kind regards, Michael

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23 hours ago, bvdboomen said:

Maybe another tip; be sure you have not overclocked the CPU and/or GPU. That could be the culprit too since MSFS is very demanding and possibly overloading the overclocked processors. I had that with my jump from P3D v4 to v5.

 

 

Thanks. Win11 and all Nvidia updates, and Asus driver/bios updates.  All mods removed, NO OC on CPU and GPU. Exceptions with BitDefender, and still CTDs with BitDefender  disabled.  Ram tested took hours, OK.  900w PSU stability test, OK.  Disabled various settings in FS2020 as advised by Zendesk and huge amount of advice from FS2020 forums.  I have tried everything possible.  A full uninstall/re-install of FS2020, and maybe a clean install of Windows may be the only answer. But WHY should I be forced to do this when Win11 and ALL other Apps, Sims and Games are running fast, faultless, and smooth?

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1 hour ago, pmb said:

I can second that. When I (very rarely) had CTDs it was always faulty or incompatible add-ons. (Aside one in-between MSFS version which was hotfixed within short time).

 

I have all addons (including those by Orbx & friends) organized with the free Addon Linker. This way I can isolate faulty add-ons using a nesting procedure. It's a bit nasty (took an hour each) but always worked so far at the end.

 

And btw., faulty addons can bring other sims to CTD as well. Believe me.

 

Kind regards, Michael

Thanks. Please read my other replies. ALL Add Ons, Mods are removed. 

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3 minutes ago, Lionhart27 said:

Thanks. Please read my other replies. ALL Add Ons, Mods are removed. 

Just saw it. In this case I'm at my wit's end.

 

Kind regards, Michael

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18 hours ago, John Dow said:

Add-ons, as in freeware normally, are the most likely cause of the CTDs.  Excessive overclocking is also a candidate.

 

The vanilla factory fresh MSFS has proven to be ultra stable and should run at Ultra settings on your computer all day every day.

 

Something isn't right, but whatever it is, it isn't MSFS itself.  AFS2 is a nice smooth sim sure, but MSFS can be just about as smooth and offer the world at your fingertips.

 

I'd be looking for a solution myself.

 

 

Thanks. Obviously a fresh install is the ONLY answer. I have tried Safe Mode but still CTD.  All Mods, and Add-Ons removed. Empty Community Folder.  How do you do a Vanilla install? Is it a fresh install without any add-ons, without the Asobo add-ons?  

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20 hours ago, tigermothpilot said:

My PC spec is very similar to yours, I have a 3090, but instead of an i9, I have an i7-11700K, and 64GB of 3200 DDR4, and MSFS runs superbly in Ultra. I strongly believe it is forces other than your PC at work here. As JoseCFII said, it could well be something in your Community Folder. Have you tried renaming it, and running MSFS in its vanilla state?

I truly think this is an outstanding sim that is only getting better.

Thanks. NOTHING IN THE COMMUNITY FOLDER. Also followed advice of Zendesk and moved the empty Community folder on to the Desktop. Please read my other replies.

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4 hours ago, pmb said:

Just saw it. In this case I'm at my wit's end.

 

Kind regards, Michael

 

Hi Michael. Just received a reply from FS2020 support (zendesk). They have analyzed all the system and other files they requested.  They say it is my virus program BitDefender that is causing the CTDs.  They said, I need to un-install it.  However, I did have an exception for the whole FS2020 folder, and they know this. Even with the exception it must continue to cause a conflict with FS2020.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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26 minutes ago, Lionhart27 said:

 

Hi Michael. Just received a reply from FS2020 support (zendesk). They have analyzed all the system and other files they requested.  They say it is my virus program BitDefender that is causing the CTDs.  They said, I need to un-install it.  However, I did have an exception for the whole FS2020 folder, and they know this. Even with the exception it must continue to cause a conflict with FS2020.

Hard to tell, but I had all sorts of issues with several paid AV programs (including Kaspersky and Bitdefender) in several simulators over the time. While they didn't block the corresponding core sims they gave me issues with specific addons. Indeed, I recall one program (I think it was connecting X-Plane to my Flight Instrument Panels) were I was near to give up, and making exceptions, including opening Firewall ports, or even deactivating the AV program didn't help. Finally I debugged with the author until he suggested uninstalling the Internet Security Program completely. This solved the case. Reinstalling and just deactivating blocked the connection again. And I recall a couple of more such experiences.

 

This made me hate all those paid AV programs and I now have been using just Windows Defender for several years (making exceptions for protection and firewall ports as well) and I never had such issues since.

 

This doesn't prove anything in your case, and it may be something completely different. But those  AV programs can be pesky (and btw. may reduce performance as well).

 

Kind regards, Michael

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I have a lot of sympathy with the original poster , as this has been the story of my experience with the SU7 update. Simply put,  constant CTD's at random times

with no real rhyme nor reason. MS2020 simply became unplayable.

 

I have reinstalled win10 4 times (keeping apps and settings) ,disabled Malwarebytes , which was the root cause of my looping files issue , but did nothing to

solve the CTD issue  , followed all the Zendesk advice regarding community folders etc, read I suspect a significant percentage of all the articles both good

and bad on MS2020 CTDs and still I kept having the problem.

 

That is until I finally , in my case tracked down the root cause of the problem.

 

This is my story.

 

What I discovered was in my particular case, the problem was all due to a program
called Nahimic. Nahimic is a group of audio drivers  designed to enhance the users audio
experience. In essence it is virtual sound software.

 

In a great many cases, PC's are shipped with Nahimic preinstalled. In my case with  a MSI motherboard, 
Nahimic is part of the MSI Dragon Center package. With Asus, it is actually installed in the bios with the
motherboard.  The problem comes from a recent change with Windows updates. Now the Nahimic driver update
adds a companion app which provides a user interface for the driver which allows you to add additional
Nahimic features.

 

In my case ever since I updated to SU7 I was getting CTD's all the time. Prior to this, my system was
completely rock solid.  What I discovered was on the day of the SU7 release, when I updated my windows, 
it also updated the Nahimic driver (nahimic mirroring device).  

 

Unfortunately this update is "buggy as hell" to quote the dozens of 
different forums that I have looked at. It seriously interferes with the audio output from games and applications
in a negative way in many instances.  When this happens , you get an immediate CTD.

 

I have attached a link to LinusTechTips about it.

 

What is nahimic companion and why is it suddenly on my custom pc? - Programs, Apps and Websites - Linus Tech Tips

 

My experience mirrors, the discussion in this article.  Simply put, Nahmic is impossible to delete, although 
with a bit of effort , in my case I was able to disable it.

 

 If you do think you have deleted it, then Windows update will simply reinstall it. There are good instructions in the article about

disabling it.

 

However, I also want to mention that I use a free Microsoft program that is perhaps the most useful bit of 
software you can ever have on your PC when you run into problems such as this.

 

It is a program called Autoruns64 which to is best described as the most comprehensive way to see (and disable (temporarily or

permentantly,  if desired), every program which is configured to run during system bootup/login or when you run windows built in 
applications.

 

It includes programs in the startup folder, Run , RunONce and other Registry keys etc. As a complete aside, it is very surprising

when you actually see all the programs and other apps that Win10 starts with.  The programs listed in the Task manager etc, are a very minor part

of the startup process.

 

Autoruns for Windows - Windows Sysinternals | Microsoft Docs

 

It is a very user friendly application, very simple to use and also allows you to use Virus Total (Google multi virus scanner
website) automatically to check an application.  So if you think that a particular application, extension
service etc. is a problem you can easily disable it from startup, reboot to see if it solves the issue.

 

In my case to be doubly sure, I found that the main Nahimic executables , the first two can be disabled by the Windows services app as

per the LinusTechTips article.

 

However.  the Nahimic Mirroring device driver along with the Nahimic Task executables,  don't show up in the windows services menu and the only

way to disable them was with Autoruns. I also found that if they are left active, Windows updates detects that and redownloads .

 

So in my case disabling Nahimic required both applications and a layered approach.

 

If you do use Autoruns, make sure you follow the instructions in LinusTechTips note on disabling the Nahimic services first , before

you use Autoruns. Otherwise windows will revert to using the Services entry  as part of its startup and you will be back at the beginning.

 

5-Capture.png


 

In my case, since doing this SU7 has been 100% CTD free, except for when I rechecked these  Nahimic
drivers, rebooted , started up MS2020 and guess what CTD.  The longest I have left MS2020 running is 34 hrs and it was perfectly fine at the end of the test.

 

I knew immediately when I started up MS2020 after disabling Nahimic that I was on the right track. I have never heard until now, that as you circle

an aircraft with its engines running that the sound varies and shifts from one stereo channel to another or the sound inside the cabin of my Kodiak

is much more muted than it is outside the aircraft. These simple pleasures did not exist with Nahimic , even though it is supposedly a virtual sound 

application. 

 

So this may not be applicable to the original author as you may not have the Nahimic device present, but I wanted to put a response together, on the

off chance that this may be of help either now or in the future if you do.  As I mentioned , it is on many different systems and 
until Windows updates the driver to include the Nahimic companion, you will never know it is there.

 

And exactly how and why Windows Updates chooses to update the driver to the Nahimic companion seems to be one of life's great mysteries.

 

In many ways , Nahimic  is not a bad program  as listening to sound while playing a video was quite nice with it, but MS2020

simply doesn't get on with it at all I discovered. 

 

I sincerely hope that this may be of some help to the original poster in combination with the latest Zendesk support  and at the very least may be helpful for future reference.

 

Cheers

Pete
 

Edited by renault
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39 minutes ago, John York said:

Boy oh boy.  Am I gad that I retired from flying!  No more hassles, no more crashes to desktop, and no more sleepless nights wondering what I had done wrong!!!

Why do you need to pretty much post the same thing twice in two days....especially when it doesn't really add to the conversation?

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2 hours ago, John York said:

Because I'm 88 years old going on 89 next month and half the time simply trying to amuse myself.  So whats wrong with that?! 

So here's a question from an 86yo  - how do you spend your time - now that you are not flying ?? - (apart from acting like a PITA - Grumpy old Man);)

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Ok boys, are we simply trying to help the OP or not. I found @renaultpost interesting in that he found an audio file was the problem. Have seen other threads/posts where anti-virus software was the problem. Don’t know why MSFS is so sensitive to other software. But it does seem to answer the question as to why some experience crashes and others do not. In my case, I have a very simple, clean basic system (but with lots of MSFS add-ons) and virtually no crashes.  Cheers.

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Well, John I spend much of my time reading Westerns.  And there's a reason for that.  But, I'll start from the beginning.  I started with photography and then oil painting for which I had a studio and the pictures I produced now adorn the walls of our home.  I couldn't carry on painting in our present home because it stunk the place out so I started writing fiction and six of my books have been published on Amazon.

 

I ran out of stories to write so now when I'm not listening to the music of The Seekers and Vera Lynn,  I read Westerns stories on my Amazon Paperwhite.  Daft I know but the reason I read Westerns is that I found reading stories about any time after 1901 (the year Wyatt Earp died) made me too depressed.  

 

Much of mine and my wife's early life was dominated by war.  I had relatives who fought and were affected by the 1914/18 war.  My wife and I were heavily involved in the 1939/45 war.  She in China as a prisoner and me in the heavily bombed East End of London  When I was 18 I was conscripted into the British Army and sent to Malaya to help fight in the war against communist terrorists trying to take over the Country.

 

So, now I read stories which are so far removed from the world we know and knew that I can walk away from them without any lasting emotional involvement.  Hope that explains it.

 

 

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44 minutes ago, John York said:

Well, John I spend much of my time reading Westerns.  And there's a reason for that.  But, I'll start from the beginning.  I started with photography and then oil painting for which I had a studio and the pictures I produced now adorn the walls of our home.  I couldn't carry on painting in our present home because it stunk the place out so I started writing fiction and six of my books have been published on Amazon.

 

I ran out of stories to write so now when I'm not listening to the music of The Seekers and Vera Lynn,  I read Westerns stories on my Amazon Paperwhite.  Daft I know but the reason I read Westerns is that I found reading stories about any time after 1901 (the year Wyatt Earp died) made me too depressed.  

 

Much of mine and my wife's early life was dominated by war.  I had relatives who fought and were affected by the 1914/18 war.  My wife and I were heavily involved in the 1939/45 war.  She in China as a prisoner and me in the heavily bombed East End of London  When I was 18 I was conscripted into the British Army and sent to Malaya to help fight in the war against communist terrorists trying to take over the Country.

 

So, now I read stories which are so far removed from the world we know and knew that I can walk away from them without any lasting emotional involvement.  Hope that explains it.

 

 

Thanks for your service mate

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1 hour ago, John York said:

Well, John I spend much of my time reading Westerns.  And there's a reason for that.  But, I'll start from the beginning.  I started with photography and then oil painting for which I had a studio and the pictures I produced now adorn the walls of our home.  I couldn't carry on painting in our present home because it stunk the place out so I started writing fiction and six of my books have been published on Amazon.

 

I ran out of stories to write so now when I'm not listening to the music of The Seekers and Vera Lynn,  I read Westerns stories on my Amazon Paperwhite.  Daft I know but the reason I read Westerns is that I found reading stories about any time after 1901 (the year Wyatt Earp died) made me too depressed.  

 

Much of mine and my wife's early life was dominated by war.  I had relatives who fought and were affected by the 1914/18 war.  My wife and I were heavily involved in the 1939/45 war.  She in China as a prisoner and me in the heavily bombed East End of London  When I was 18 I was conscripted into the British Army and sent to Malaya to help fight in the war against communist terrorists trying to take over the Country.

 

So, now I read stories which are so far removed from the world we know and knew that I can walk away from them without any lasting emotional involvement.  Hope that explains it.

 

 

Thanks for the explanation John - and at the risk of upsetting Frank - ( i'll just point him in the direction of my Melbourne video;)) - and as regards the thread itself

- apart from the great advice - as usual - from Renault - it was just a repeat of the boring - Good Cop - Bad Cop analogy as applied to flight sims - so

that leaves me clear to have chat with John - who maybe thought about the thread as I do - and like me - a fugitive from the OLD COOTS club

 

Aside from the luck to reach a ripe old age - John - we both have a lot in common - my  paintings also adorn some of our walls but the boss lady wants the rest in the garage - and thankfully - 9 grandkids take a few to satisify pop --- in my case - the gap between Vera and the Seekers - is filled by Bill Haley - and my Paperwhite is 

well used but I prefer the hard covers - --- - I lost 2 grandfathers and 4 great uncles in WW1 -- and in May 1940 we were bombed out of house in the North of England

- so thaks to Adolf - I got to live in Blackpool  ----- For Malaya - You must have the same GSM medal as I got as a NS in Suez and Cyprus.

 

Maybe I will join you in 2 years when I get to 89 - disliking flying -but I doubt it  - since I did have a PPL and owned an aircraft or 2 - and have been simming since '82

Just a word of advice- if I may- try Acrylic - it doesn't stink - dries quick - and more colourful - and if you aren't there already - join the old coots club:D

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I remember Bill Haley and the Comets but can't say I liked them much.  I liked the tunes and songs we used to have when ballrooom dancing. A mate and I took a series of lessons in ballroom dancing when we were still young teenagers.  He said it was a good way of getting friendly with girls!  I thought that was a good idea too and must say I did like the music from bands like Ted Heath and even Victor Sylvester.  In those days we were members of the local YMCA Red Triangle Club and in my area the YMCA had a huge building that accommodated a swimming pool, two dance floors one of which doubled as a club room, A large cafeteria, snooker hall with about a dozen tables, a basketball court, and a table tennis room.  It was massive!  Apart from the front, there were outside tennis courts.

 

On Sunday evenings the whole gang of us would go to the cinema filling up two rows in the circle and see all the latest films.  We even lied about our ages and saw 'The Outlaw' starring the busty Jane Russell.  There were some uncomfortable nights after seeing that film!!!

 

This was all in East London and I must emphasise you could walk about there at any time of the day and night in complete safety.  The gangsters wouldn't allow crime in the area they lived in!

 

Playing football in the winter and cricket in the summer and when we could fit it in, tennis in the summer and table-tennis in the winter.   Boy, were we fit in those days! And I had met my future wife and started going out with her.   National Service at 18 brought it all to an end except my attraction for my lovely Sheila and you know the rest.

 

Oh, and acrylic.  Tried it, didn't like it and turned my interest to writing.  Now, I simply read and love it.  

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