active TEGB South P3Dv4.4 - settings for smooth performance at 4K

[kevinfirth]

6 hours ago, John Dow said:

 

It will take time.  In the meantime have yo checked out the posts and threads for disabling all unnecessary scenery layers and deletion of the shader and scenery cache stuff.  Those actions made my TE GB quite smooth.  Sorry I don't have the links but the posts should be searchable.

Thanks John, I'm in the fortunate position of working with great hardware, so the issue of performance isnt a big one for me and I'm not needing to compromise on disabling parts of the scenery :). My question was purely out of interest.  JV has said in another thread it will be a day or so, so I can wait til then!  Who knows maybe v4.5 will be out then? :p

[John Venema]

Aiming for Thu/Fri next week, we are finding lots of areas which can be optimised so it’s worth the extra time.

[The Merowinger]

Nobody knows when 4.5 will be out (officially), but other developers (making  airplanes), haven't release their updates too, though they had to be out already. I guess in 4.5 there are some improvements regarding PBR and performance too. So waiting a little bit could save a lot of work.

 

Kai

[Adam Banks]

One observation I'd like to throw into this mix ...

 

I was playing with old versions of the Hawker Tempest, test-flying them over TEGB. I found an old freeware version that looked quite small (and presumably not too complex) but it totally *crucified* my frame rate. I then loaded up my (equally old) payware Hawker Heroes version (much bigger and way more complex) and found it ran perfectly well in TEGB.

 

So... the moral of the story is that some (maybe badly designed) aircraft may seriously impact your TEGB experience. Obviously, if the same aircraft behaves OK everywhere else but TEGB then TEGB needs to have some settings tweaked. However - I'm thinking that a badly coded add-on (I think with gauges in particular) may just be the straw that broke the camel's back, resource-wise. Try other (maybe even default) aircraft - and see what happens.

 

Just a thought.

[European Mountain Man]

Thanks John for the settings it works like a dream i was struggling with p3dv4.4  and now running good thanks regards EMM stewart

[Delly]

Just installed 1.1, loaded JV settings and it seems to be smoother outside London but its the same stuttering over the city, (maybe worse actually but I need to test more and reset my p3d config.. perhaps I will need to turn scenery off from the new control panel.

 

Still disappointing you can't use the P3D scenery density slider, I don't want to remove all terrace houses or all London Bridges.. ah well.

 

My main problem now is I get autogen in the English Channel and rivers, any pointers to what I have done wrong?  Perhaps this is why my performance is worse in London.

 

I have tried Verify Files. I have openLC Europe and FTX England. Migration Checker says ok for all installed scenery.

 

 

[asustech]

I know this sounds mad but I did the modify option with p3d v4.4 files in windows 10 apps section and after firing up p3d my experience over London has greatly improved ....  maybe worth a shot for those struggling 

[GSalden]

7 hours ago, asustech said:

I know this sounds mad but I did the modify option with p3d v4.4 files in windows 10 apps section and after firing up p3d my experience over London has greatly improved ....  maybe worth a shot for those struggling 

 

What mod ?

[Rob Ainscough]

I disabled a considerable number of items (about 50%) from the configuration panel, turn graphics settings down, performance was still below 30 fps and lots of long frames but it was flyable in a GA aircraft.  But what I noticed is that many of buildings have holes/gaps in their roofs?  It looks like some object optimization gone wrong ... or perhaps the combination of unchecked 50% of the objects in the configuration panel triggered this anomaly? 

 

Rob.

[carlosqr]

I'll try the settings as I'm very anxious for flying the area since I bought it but had to updrade to Win10, buy more memory and planning to upgrade my video card, so I'll try this before spending more money on upgrades.

 

Thanks

[asustech]

On 3/27/2019 at 6:31 AM, GSalden said:

 

What mod ?

as screen shows

[GSalden]

9 hours ago, asustech said:

as screen shows

 

?   No idea what you are pointing to ....

[BrianV]

I need to congratulate you on the latest update of P3D England South. Performance on my i7 computer with GTX 980 is so smooth now, and I no longer have popping terrain like I sometimes had with FTX England. Great achievement by the ORBX team, and truly a VFR dream come true. I look forward to more TrueEarth releases this great. 

[twright]

Hi,

 

Just to say these settings did help and my FRs are now fairly reasonable as long as I use a moderate aircraft.

However for me, having the 'Use high-resolution terrain textures' box disabled made my terrain really blurry and slow to load in. When I enable it the textures load much quicker and are sharper.

Just wondered if anyone else has noticed this?

 

Cheers

[carlosqr]

3 hours ago, twright said:

When I enable it the textures load much quicker and are sharper. 

Hi Very interesting

The settings indeed allowed me to fly TEGBS too, though my computer still struggles a bit while flying in London. A bit of slow camera (look like) and blurry textures appear often but I know I need to upgrade yet my video card.

I think I'd like to give it a try as you did just for testing.

Cheers

[Rob Ainscough]

I'm curious, was TE GB South for P3D V4 created and compiled with native P3D V4.x SDK using 3DSMax and the P3D V4.x SDK plugin?

 

I'm pretty sure ORBX did NOT use the XP10 SDK to create TE GB South for XP11.

 

Reason I ask is that I've used native P3D V4 products from other vendors with maxed out graphic settings (very high density of objects) and performance has been exceptional (no problem locking to 30 FPS with minimal long frames).  So I'm puzzled as to why Orbx TE GB South P3D seems to be suffering so much even with reduced graphic settings and turning off 60% of the Control Panel options for TE GB South?

 

Rob.

[twright]

16 hours ago, Rob Ainscough said:

I'm curious, was TE GB South for P3D V4 created and compiled with native P3D V4.x SDK using 3DSMax and the P3D V4.x SDK plugin?

 

I'm pretty sure ORBX did NOT use the XP10 SDK to create TE GB South for XP11.

 

Reason I ask is that I've used native P3D V4 products from other vendors with maxed out graphic settings (very high density of objects) and performance has been exceptional (no problem locking to 30 FPS with minimal long frames).  So I'm puzzled as to why Orbx TE GB South P3D seems to be suffering so much even with reduced graphic settings and turning off 60% of the Control Panel options for TE GB South?

 

Rob.

 

I agree with you Rob. For me P3Dv4 has been butter smooth until adding this product. I'm not doubting the visual beauty of this package, but this sort of performance impact is more akin to my FSX days!

[Colin David Hodds]

Any chance of new settings for 4.5 be damned if I can get it to work maxing out my RTX 2080 VRAM and 16gig of memory help would be appreciated . Revert back to 4.4 and vram and memory better . Peformance was not great but at least usable . Waited for the patch helped marginally , waited for 4.5 in the hope of Improvement not unuasable .

[Rob Ainscough]

There does appear to be a issue with V4.5, see my post here: http://www.prepar3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=196524#p196540

 

If you run at 30Hz Vsync then the issue may not be apparent/noticeable.  The issue appears to be an LM problem as I was able to replicate a -29% FPS drop using a base default V4.4 vs. V4.5 installations (no add-ons).  And then ran same tests with ORBX Germany North and South (and FTX Global) where FPS was down over 50%.

 

Rob.

[kevinfirth]

1 hour ago, Rob Ainscough said:

There does appear to be a issue with V4.5, see my post here: http://www.prepar3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=196524#p196540

 

If you run at 30Hz Vsync then the issue may not be apparent/noticeable.  The issue appears to be an LM problem as I was able to replicate a -29% FPS drop using a base default V4.4 vs. V4.5 installations (no add-ons).  And then ran same tests with ORBX Germany North and South (and FTX Global) where FPS was down over 50%.

 

Rob.

can you share the details of memory useage as well Rob in those tests, RAM and vRAM, for both default and Orbx scenery? Ive seen massive memory use and noted another user reporting that here as well..

[Colin David Hodds]

 

I have seen Robs table for Vram and memory and not bad cant say the same for me

Vram for me with 4.5 JV settings very modest  No weather 30hz refresh rate and vsync on

Orbx TrueEarth at Southampton EGHI DA62 no weather 

Ram 12.4

Vram 7

start flying and this rises 

My system has 16gig of ram and a RTX 2080 hence my concern

Did go back to 4.4 yesterday and condiderably lower but have not got figures at least 3 gig lower

FTX England at Southampton EGHI DA62 no weather 

Ram 6.2 gig

vram 3.2

 

True earth certainly hates 4.5 reposting this in P3D forum

[Colin David Hodds]

1 hour ago, Colin David Hodds said:

 

I have seen Robs table for Vram and memory and not bad cant say the same for me

Vram for me with 4.5 JV settings very modest  No weather 30hz refresh rate and vsync on

Orbx TrueEarth at Southampton EGHI DA62 no weather 

Ram 12.4

Vram 7

start flying and this rises 

My system has 16gig of ram and a RTX 2080 hence my concern

Did go back to 4.4 yesterday and condiderably lower but have not got figures at least 3 gig lower

FTX England at Southampton EGHI DA62 no weather 

Ram 6.2 gig

vram 3.2

 

True earth certainly hates 4.5 reposting this in P3D forum

4.4 JV settings   No weather 30hz refresh rate and vsync onOrbx TrueEarth at Southampton EGHI DA62 no weather 
Ram 4.4   7meg    4.5   12.4 meg
Vram 4.4   4 meg   4.5   7meg 

[twright]

I'm still on 4.4. FPS are acceptable (but not great) but it's the blurry terrain that I can't live with. Everything is crisp and sharp for the first few minutes but then it becomes a blurry mess the further I fly and can take up to 30 seconds to a minute paused for it to load in again. My CPU usage is pegged at 100% (4770k at 4.2GHz). GPU (GTX1060) is only at about 55%.

I wish it was possible to reduce the autogen slightly, it seems it's either all or nothing with the density sliders.

 

[Rob Ainscough]

7 hours ago, kevinfirth said:

can you share the details of memory useage as well Rob in those tests, RAM and vRAM, for both default and Orbx scenery? Ive seen massive memory use and noted another user reporting that here as well..

 

All the data (including RAM and VRAM) is presented in the link to P3D forum.

 

Cheers, Rob.

[kevinfirth]

43 minutes ago, Rob Ainscough said:

 

All the data (including RAM and VRAM) is presented in the link to P3D forum.

 

Cheers, Rob.

Hmm, I saw much higher memory useage than that - I need to test it more methodically though before reporting it

[Colin David Hodds]

I only see high vram with true earth GB south 

[kevinfirth]

2 minutes ago, Colin David Hodds said:

I only see high vram with true earth GB south 

ok that's useful thanks colin

[Rob Ainscough]

6 hours ago, kevinfirth said:

Hmm, I saw much higher memory useage than that

 

I was NOT using any additional "tweaks" ... all "as is" graphics settings that can be set via UI.  If you are seeing very high VRAM usage there are a few "tweaks" that can cause that:

 

1.  TEXTURE_SIZE_EXP = 10  (you can easily exceed 11GB VRAM and in some cases exceed 32GB RAM)

2.  MAX_TEXTURE_REQUEST_DISTANCE=32000 (or more)

3.  OPAQUE_SHADOW_TEXTURE_SIZE=8192, TRANSLUCENT_SHADOW_TEXTURE_SIZE=2048, OPAQUE_SHADOW_DRAW_DISTANCE=8000, TRANSLUCENT_SHADOW_DRAW_DISTANCE=8000

 

Assuming you have all the other graphics settings at max values, those above will quickly get you above 11GB VRAM and 32GB RAM in ORBX GB South.  BUT, if you stick with what can be done via Graphics settings UI and don't tweak your .cfg then 7-9GB VRAM is expected in a GB South.

 

Rob.

[kevinfirth]

1 hour ago, Rob Ainscough said:

 

I was NOT using any additional "tweaks" ... all "as is" graphics settings that can be set via UI.  If you are seeing very high VRAM usage there are a few "tweaks" that can cause that:

 

1.  TEXTURE_SIZE_EXP = 10  (you can easily exceed 11GB VRAM and in some cases exceed 32GB RAM)

2.  MAX_TEXTURE_REQUEST_DISTANCE=32000 (or more)

3.  OPAQUE_SHADOW_TEXTURE_SIZE=8192, TRANSLUCENT_SHADOW_TEXTURE_SIZE=2048, OPAQUE_SHADOW_DRAW_DISTANCE=8000, TRANSLUCENT_SHADOW_DRAW_DISTANCE=8000

 

Assuming you have all the other graphics settings at max values, those above will quickly get you above 11GB VRAM and 32GB RAM in ORBX GB South.  BUT, if you stick with what can be done via Graphics settings UI and don't tweak your .cfg then 7-9GB VRAM is expected in a GB South.

 

Rob.

Thanks Rob.

 

I used no additional tweaks either.   Following your test results I've done a series of identical flights around EGHI using P3D 4.5, first of all in default scenery, then in GBS with decreasing settings, each time dropping a slider notch.

 

I havent had time to replicate those flights in 4.4 I'm afraid gor comparative purposes.

 

Whilst most of the time I'd say youre right, dropping 'Autogen and Scenery draw distance' from very high to high actually INCREASED vRAM use, despite being clearly able to visualise the decreased draw distance on screen.. For most of the tests I used over 8Gb VRAM so anyone not using a card with more than that would have sustained an even greater gps hit.

 

The unticking of 'hi-res ground images' didnt appear to make much difference.  Other settings produced a slight increase in performance.  Each test showed a number of distinctly long frames in the same locations each time.

 

Consistent with your results, the majority of the time fps stayed above 30 so running with vsync wouldnt have showed up many differences.

 

Id have tried to produce a 4-in-1 video like you did to show this but I had to download and start learning a new video-editing suite from Blackmagic....not quite got to grips with it yet!

[Rob Ainscough]

I wouldn't spend too much time on this, I'd be really surprised if LM don't provide a hotfix to V4.5 to resolve this problem.  This is NOT ORBX specific, with no add-ons, comparing V4.4 to V4.5 and V4.5 FPS is down 29% ... I'm 99.9% sure this is not "by design" as you can see from my video, there is no "visual" difference but there is a significant FPS drop. 

 

Of course that doesn't let ORBX off the hook for NOT using P3D V4 SDK and not using the Add-On method ... I know, I know, support is eventually coming ... just seems a little unfair to handicap P3D with whatever FSX can do while leveraging XP11 SDK for XP11.

 

I use Adobe Premiere Pro for video editing (it actually doesn't do well with highly compressed 4K res MP4) ... if you're looking cheaper "freeware" solutions to video editing, you might want to checkout HitFilm Express.  They have freeware and payware versions.

 

Rob.

[kevinfirth]

2 hours ago, Rob Ainscough said:

I wouldn't spend too much time on this, I'd be really surprised if LM don't provide a hotfix to V4.5 to resolve this problem.  This is NOT ORBX specific, with no add-ons, comparing V4.4 to V4.5 and V4.5 FPS is down 29% ... I'm 99.9% sure this is not "by design" as you can see from my video, there is no "visual" difference but there is a significant FPS drop. 

 

Of course that doesn't let ORBX off the hook for NOT using P3D V4 SDK and not using the Add-On method ... I know, I know, support is eventually coming ... just seems a little unfair to handicap P3D with whatever FSX can do while leveraging XP11 SDK for XP11.

 

I use Adobe Premiere Pro for video editing (it actually doesn't do well with highly compressed 4K res MP4) ... if you're looking cheaper "freeware" solutions to video editing, you might want to checkout HitFilm Express.  They have freeware and payware versions.

 

Rob.

thanks  I spent time on it for the purpose of learning to better produce evidenced reports useful to LM and 3PD,so not time wasted.  And also just to better understand how P3D and TE-UK work together so I can optimise my settings for better results for me :)

[JoshS99]

so like, i have the following ORBX addons:

ORBX global base

vector

trees

great britain south photoreal

openlceurope

latest libraries update

 

no matter what my scenery doesnt look like yours or what ORBX advertised in their trueearth GBS scenery photos and i dont know why? even after trying max settings it still doesnt look anything alike and im starting to feel conned in that i didnt get what i saw aka false advertisment.

 

[bruce e]

Josh that post is NOT the way to get help!

What are your PC specs?

Check "Dynamic 3D Autogen" is not selected.

Use "Global Trees HD"

[kevinfirth]

I'm doing a series of video tests showing how P3D4.5 and Orbx TE work with various settings.  Here's a first, with a flight around EGHI in first of all default scenery, and then with high settings only changing the LOD radius.   All performance stats on screen so you can compare differences.  Next up, Autogen and Scenery draw distance....

 

[Colin David Hodds]

18 hours ago, Rob Ainscough said:

 

I was NOT using any additional "tweaks" ... all "as is" graphics settings that can be set via UI.  If you are seeing very high VRAM usage there are a few "tweaks" that can cause that:

 

1.  TEXTURE_SIZE_EXP = 10  (you can easily exceed 11GB VRAM and in some cases exceed 32GB RAM)

2.  MAX_TEXTURE_REQUEST_DISTANCE=32000 (or more)

3.  OPAQUE_SHADOW_TEXTURE_SIZE=8192, TRANSLUCENT_SHADOW_TEXTURE_SIZE=2048, OPAQUE_SHADOW_DRAW_DISTANCE=8000, TRANSLUCENT_SHADOW_DRAW_DISTANCE=8000

 

Assuming you have all the other graphics settings at max values, those above will quickly get you above 11GB VRAM and 32GB RAM in ORBX GB South.  BUT, if you stick with what can be done via Graphics settings UI and don't tweak your .cfg then 7-9GB VRAM is expected in a GB South.

 

Rob.

Hi Rob , first thing I though when I saw high vram was Max _texture and had LM changed it . I tried way back on 4.4 your tweak but reverted always delete config on new release and no tweaking anymore . Waiting to see if LM come up with anything.

[JoshS99]

12 hours ago, bruce e said:

Josh that post is NOT the way to get help!

What are your PC specs?

Check "Dynamic 3D Autogen" is not selected.

Use "Global Trees HD"

i5 7600k clocked at 4 cores 4.8ghz, 4.7ghz cache. 2x8gb 3600 mhz ram. gtx 1080. kc1000 480gb nvme ssd.

[JamieBrooks]

On 4/15/2019 at 3:00 AM, Rob Ainscough said:

I wouldn't spend too much time on this, I'd be really surprised if LM don't provide a hotfix to V4.5 to resolve this problem.  This is NOT ORBX specific, with no add-ons, comparing V4.4 to V4.5 and V4.5 FPS is down 29% ... I'm 99.9% sure this is not "by design" as you can see from my video, there is no "visual" difference but there is a significant FPS drop. 

 

Of course that doesn't let ORBX off the hook for NOT using P3D V4 SDK and not using the Add-On method ... I know, I know, support is eventually coming ... just seems a little unfair to handicap P3D with whatever FSX can do while leveraging XP11 SDK for XP11.

 

I use Adobe Premiere Pro for video editing (it actually doesn't do well with highly compressed 4K res MP4) ... if you're looking cheaper "freeware" solutions to video editing, you might want to checkout HitFilm Express.  They have freeware and payware versions.

 

Rob.

 

Update from LM... looks like it is due in the next fortnight

 

https://www.prepar3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6312&p=196776&sid=f8a07ffc1f95cc50fcb020ab56795d56#p196776

[Rob Ainscough]

2 hours ago, JamieBrooks said:

Update from LM... looks like it is due in the next fortnight

 

Yes, we made progress in locating a specific build where issue may have started (combination of issues) ... more testing then hopefully a released HotFix soonish.

 

Cheers, Rob.

[JamieBrooks]

Just now, Rob Ainscough said:

 

Yes, we made progress in locating a specific build where issue may have started (combination of issues) ... more testing then hopefully a released HotFix soonish.

 

Cheers, Rob.

 

Good news, I will stick to 4.5 until released

[kevinfirth]

54 minutes ago, Rob Ainscough said:

 

Yes, we made progress in locating a specific build where issue may have started (combination of issues) ... more testing then hopefully a released HotFix soonish.

 

Cheers, Rob.

Thanks for your work on this Rob