Mac_Maddog88 Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 Hello everyone, New account here, it's been months so I forgot my credentials for my old account (Outrage). Anyways, it's good to be back. I've been flying a ton of XPlane lately and one thing that I love about that sim is how much better the water looks. Specifically, the transition between different forms of waterclass isn't as jarring as ESP, especially in tropical areas where I can look and just pick out the blockiness of ESP's waterclass. Something I would love to see for FSX and P3D is an addon that would function for water sort of the way FTX Global does for land; smoothing out the transitions between water classes and just making coastal areas look a whole lot nicer in general. Flying in tropical areas is just kind of unpleasent due to how ESP handles waterclass. Any chance we could have something to improve this? -Mac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominique Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 Hi Marc I couldn't agree more. The more OrbX improves the ground environment, the more the water environment looks cartoonish, out of whack. I miss the shallow coastal waters (tropical or not) but also the muddy rivers/estuaries, the salted ponds etc.. It sometime kills the immersion factor than OrbX brings along. I had that experience recently flying over Northern Nevada... OrbX has never been receptive to the idea so far. Lack of sources or assuming a lack of interest of the public ? I don't know but I, for one, would pay for an OpenLC NA (water) as a priority addon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfko Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 Orbx full fat regions also improve water class! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ripcord Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 FTX Bahamas!!! Woooo-hooooo! Seriously, who wouldn't buy that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac_Maddog88 Posted August 20, 2016 Author Share Posted August 20, 2016 2 minutes ago, Ripcord said: FTX Bahamas!!! Woooo-hooooo! Seriously, who wouldn't buy that? I would buy that in a second. Would love to do more flights around Bonaire, Marteen, etc, but I'm just really put off by the water. It's so cartoonish looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominique Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 Waterclass wouldnt do justice to that kind of spectacular scenery (Bahamas, the Keys etc.) without having new textures à la Global. And even then... Only PR imagery may do the trick, like in Orbx Pago Pago. Now, lets wait for a certain scenery that Tim & Ken might cook right now . But that does not preclude also having some product improving the water rendition on very large areas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iflygary Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 2 hours ago, wolfko said: Orbx full fat regions also improve water class! Totally agree, however once you move away from the full fat regions the water depiction in some areas can be DREADFUL to say the least. Prior to open LC North America, I spent 95% of my flying in full fat regions only. I figured once I picked up open LC North America that would change to about 50% open LC and the other 50% in the full fat regions. Open LC is a marvelous product! I flew out of my home airport KTPF down to the Florida Keys enjoying the scenery, however, the way the sim depicts the waters here in the Tampa Bay Area is just painful to look at. There is, no, tropical blue water anywhere in the Bay area. I then decided to do some flying in my childhood state of Louisiana. Once again, Open LC brilliant! Water class, unsightly. Lake Pontchartrain water looks like Bahamas waters. I'd have to say that my percentages have now changed, but only slightly. About 80/20. While it's nice to venture out of the full fat regions and explore the other areas, the water class quickly has me returning to PNW, AUS, Alaska, etc. I never imagined years ago having scenery the quality Orbx has provided us, so maybe one day we can say the same about the water class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac_Maddog88 Posted August 20, 2016 Author Share Posted August 20, 2016 Along with waterclass, it would be really cool to see a form of generic watermasking actually worked into the shorline textures for the vector data (If that's even possible). My favorite thing about photoreal scenery has to the watermasks and their blend between land and sea/lakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KORDATC Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 I would also love to see a waterclass product. Would add immensely to the realism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry_R Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 As you guys might guess, the look of the water is really important for my interests. P3D has come a long way in this regard; when I switch back and forth between P3D v3 and FSX, to my eye the water in FSX often looks like plastic. I think the LM guys are committed to improving the look of the water and they continue to tweak things. If you use the Ultra water setting (3D waves) and you are bold you can (carefully) edit the Triton resources configuration file. I should mention that LM's advice is not to do this because among other things, not all parameters are used. Nonetheless, if you back up the original file there are some things you can tweak if you become bored. For example being able to tell the direction of the wind by looking at the sea is particularly important to floatplane pilots. However the default P3D setting allows cross seas as much as ~40 degrees off the direction of the wind. At least that was the setting last time I checked. The result is that it's very difficult to judge the exact direction of the wind. For my own use, I've had good luck tweaking the appropriate setting so that my estimate of the direction of the wind by looking at the sea state is pretty close to the direction used by the sim. There are other settings that can be adjusted, but all have global effect so if you tune them for one region they may not look that realistic in others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Hall Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 2 hours ago, dominique said: Waterclass wouldnt do justice to that kind of spectacular scenery (Bahamas, the Keys etc.) without having new textures à la Global. And even then... Only PR imagery may do the trick, like in Orbx Pago Pago. Now, lets wait for a certain scenery that Tim & Ken might cook right now . But that does not preclude also having some product improving the water rendition on very large areas. Our next project is surrounded by water, huge dams to land on, get your amphibious aircraft ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotoDave Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 If memory serves, my high quality after market water class clashes with the UK water class. So, it's not all guns and roses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KORDATC Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 1 hour ago, Ken Hall said: Our next project is surrounded by water, huge dams to land on, get your amphibious aircraft ready. Could it be Lake Mead? Now that would be awesome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmb Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 Lake Mead woudn't fit into Ken's and Tim's record. Kind regards, Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnost Posted August 21, 2016 Share Posted August 21, 2016 Using DX10 with DX10 Fixer water colors got worse in FSX Acceleration. Added the Water Configurator program and now I have very believable colors in both northern and southern waters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juanvito Posted August 21, 2016 Share Posted August 21, 2016 A waterclass product is in my wishlist as well. Something that improves the resolution of existing worldwide waterclasses would be enough for me to buy, as long as it is compatible with Vector. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfko Posted August 21, 2016 Share Posted August 21, 2016 22 hours ago, Ken Hall said: Our next project is surrounded by water, huge dams to land on, get your amphibious aircraft ready. Combining this info with the hints Ken an Tim had already given in past threads, I'll bet on the Bahamas or the Florida Keys! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave302 Posted August 21, 2016 Share Posted August 21, 2016 There is freeware waterclass scenery for South Florida, the Bahamas, and Mexico. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KORDATC Posted August 21, 2016 Share Posted August 21, 2016 53 minutes ago, wolfko said: Combining this info with the hints Ken an Tim had already given in past threads, I'll bet on the Bahamas or the Florida Keys! Yeah, but there aren't any dams in the Bahamas or Florida Keys since they are all little islands in the ocean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Lars Posted August 21, 2016 Share Posted August 21, 2016 I second the wish for a waterclass, but not without including to have ICE in the polar regions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac_Maddog88 Posted August 21, 2016 Author Share Posted August 21, 2016 5 hours ago, KORDATC said: Yeah, but there aren't any dams in the Bahamas or Florida Keys since they are all little islands in the ocean. Dam can also mean large shoreline or a natural structure holding back a large body of water. If this mystery project IS the Bahamas, I'm sure Ken and Tim would have more than enough money to retire on after release! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfko Posted August 21, 2016 Share Posted August 21, 2016 5 hours ago, KORDATC said: Yeah, but there aren't any dams in the Bahamas or Florida Keys since they are all little islands in the ocean. I was more thinking of dikes, embankments etc. for land reclamation in order to build airports. Sorry, in German it's the same word for all these different meanings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KORDATC Posted August 21, 2016 Share Posted August 21, 2016 Haha no problem wolfko. I would absolutely love the Bahamas or Florida Keys! One of my favorite things to do in Flight Sim is island hop in which the Bahamas are perfect for! There are so many landing strips on those islands! But back to my original guess - alake Mead has the Hoover Dam and a ton of seaplane traffic. He did say it would include dams you could land on. We shall see. They will surprise us nonetheless! Cheers, Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfko Posted August 22, 2016 Share Posted August 22, 2016 12 hours ago, KORDATC said: Haha no problem wolfko. I would absolutely love the Bahamas or Florida Keys! One of my favorite things to do in Flight Sim is island hop in which the Bahamas are perfect for! There are so many landing strips on those islands! But back to my original guess - alake Mead has the Hoover Dam and a ton of seaplane traffic. He did say it would include dams you could land on. We shall see. They will surprise us nonetheless! Cheers, Rob I totally agree, Lake Mead would be great. But there are no cabbage palms AFIK. Ken and Tim said in another topic, that there were cabbage palms in the area they are currently working on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spud Posted August 22, 2016 Share Posted August 22, 2016 Striking's FS Water Configurator allows you to set water just about any way you want it to look. http://www.strikingsoftware.com/index.shtml They also have a lot more to offer besides the Configurator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmb Posted August 22, 2016 Share Posted August 22, 2016 FS Water Configurator once was a gem, however, as far as I know it never made it to Prepar3d/DX11 shaders - or do you know a way to get it working? Thanks and kind regards, Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spud Posted August 22, 2016 Share Posted August 22, 2016 P3D is not on my plate so I do not have any idea if Striking was ever updated to that sim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Lars Posted August 22, 2016 Share Posted August 22, 2016 Do you really don't care if there's no ice at all on the oceans during wintertime, or do you all prefer the warmer regions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireRx Posted August 22, 2016 Share Posted August 22, 2016 On 8/20/2016 at 7:43 AM, Larry_R said: As you guys might guess, the look of the water is really important for my interests. P3D has come a long way in this regard; when I switch back and forth between P3D v3 and FSX, to my eye the water in FSX often looks like plastic. I think the LM guys are committed to improving the look of the water and they continue to tweak things. If you use the Ultra water setting (3D waves) and you are bold you can (carefully) edit the Triton resources configuration file. I should mention that LM's advice is not to do this because among other things, not all parameters are used. Nonetheless, if you back up the original file there are some things you can tweak if you become bored. For example being able to tell the direction of the wind by looking at the sea is particularly important to floatplane pilots. However the default P3D setting allows cross seas as much as ~40 degrees off the direction of the wind. At least that was the setting last time I checked. The result is that it's very difficult to judge the exact direction of the wind. For my own use, I've had good luck tweaking the appropriate setting so that my estimate of the direction of the wind by looking at the sea state is pretty close to the direction used by the sim. There are other settings that can be adjusted, but all have global effect so if you tune them for one region they may not look that realistic in others. Agree, Larry, After dipping from lakes and other bodies of water for fire fighting in P3D. I gel close enough to see the surface scum on the water. it's really noticeable at 300 ft above the water in a hover. the only water features needing improvement in Prepar3D is the waterfalls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominique Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 On 8/20/2016 at 4:46 PM, Ken Hall said: Our next project is surrounded by water, huge dams to land on, get your amphibious aircraft ready. I hope we'll get some ground landing strips too (hard, semi-hard, soft, muddy, dusty, grassy, your choice. Even buffalo not to say alligator ridden), I find the water landing/takeoff a little unconvincing in my favorite sim (P3D3) . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Hall Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 1 hour ago, dominique said: I hope we'll get some ground landing strips too (hard, semi-hard, soft, muddy, dusty, grassy, your choice. Even buffalo not to say alligator ridden), I find the water landing/takeoff a little unconvincing in my favorite sim (P3D3) . always plenty of dry land as well as getting you out of your comfort zone, helicopters, amphibious aircraft, all catered for, do you have the right stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perk Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 I'm guessing FTX: Zuiderzee! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boleyd Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 The water is fine. Especially in Orbx Regions. Increasing the cost (buy bigger video cards) is not something I would ever do to take water to a higher level of reality. It is just not worth the money given it is a good display now. I agree that waterfalls need work. Resolution and lighting are weak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iflygary Posted August 23, 2016 Share Posted August 23, 2016 11 hours ago, boleyd said: The water is fine. Especially in Orbx Regions. Increasing the cost (buy bigger video cards) is not something I would ever do to take water to a higher level of reality. It is just not worth the money given it is a good display now. I agree that waterfalls need work. Resolution and lighting are weak. The Orbx Full fat regions is not where the water is a problem. It's in the other areas. I'm totally willing to spend more money on a better looking waterclass if it were developed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotoDave Posted August 24, 2016 Share Posted August 24, 2016 At least around the UK, I don't think ORBX water class matches up with either default water class, or aftermarket. So, for some of us it's a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SolRayz Posted August 24, 2016 Share Posted August 24, 2016 Default water class throughout the Caribbean and the Bahamas in particular is a travesty. In fact there is nothing more immersion killing than heading south east out of KMIA and approaching the Bahamas. Its like Avatar threw up down there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfko Posted August 24, 2016 Share Posted August 24, 2016 35 minutes ago, SolRayz said: Default water class throughout the Caribbean and the Bahamas in particular is a travesty. In fact there is nothing more immersion killing than heading south east out of KMIA and approaching the Bahamas. Its like Avatar threw up down there. Which sim? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SolRayz Posted August 24, 2016 Share Posted August 24, 2016 FSX and P3D alike. Not much variation between the two when addressing waterclass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominique Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 No need to go to the tropical islands ! I did a nice flight yesterday between Valdosta Ga to St Simons Island (wanted to land in Jekyll but the crosswind was too strong ), flying over Fargo Ga to see how the Okefenokee swamps and the coastal marshlands looked like. Vector and OLNA do a very good job at rendering the ground but the blue water was a little weird in the marshlands (no silt). It was a little more palatable in the swamps as P3D tinted the water a darker blue. Still, it could be better there too. I would say the same for Southern Louisiana. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juanvito Posted August 26, 2016 Share Posted August 26, 2016 I think anything more complicated than improving the resolution of existing waterclasses would have to be a collaboration between REX and ORBX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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